Erection problems from PE (I think)

tbirdy,

>You have my respect in the field of creating hanging equipment and doing buisness with it by selling it to all the masses. its good profit eh ?<

Actually, it is no profit at all. It costs me money. What little is made above costs is given to my sons who are making the hangers.

>But you have absolutely no credibility when you talk about
-quote:
"
I have been on three different Penis Enlargement boards for over seven years. I have read the Penis Enlargement experiences of thousands of guys. The vast majority are successful, with better erection quality after Penis Enlargement. There are very few cases of poor erection quality after Penis Enlargement."

Truth is, you have financial interests and sure as hell you will always support Penis Enlargement to protect your interests.<

If you actually had been around for a while, you would know I have stopped making hangers on several occasions because of lack of time, and only started again when guys begged me to make them. You would also know I have never advertised, and consistantly recommend, that guys make their own hangers. You would also know I have provided instructions for guys to make their own hangers. You would also know that it is very difficult for most guys to buy a hanger, since I don't provide any credit card system through which to order.

Given the above, you really think I am out for profit? I have a successful real estate business, that takes most of my time. I could use time spent on hangers, and answering questions, much better, and more profitably, in my normal career. Considering development costs, I will never even break even on hangers, unless I sold the patent, or marketing rights. But I will not do that, at least in the near future, because it is knowledge which makes Penis Enlargement successful for an individual, not any device.

>You also admitted that a small tiny itty bitty fraction of the Penis Enlargement world ends up injured. Because ? AAAh because they used loop devices and didn#t buy your hangers. Talk about advertizing.<

Actually, I only know of one guy, that was hanging correctly, that injured himself. If you look closely, you will see that many more guys are injured by manual means, than from hanging.

>TRUTH is , there are hundrets and thousands of guys like me.<

And where is your proof of that statement?

>Guys who had bad luck and NOT due to bad equipment or too much stress or wrong techniques. NO. I'm sure everyone followed common sense and did the Penis Enlargement the same way the others did. As you DO know Penis Enlargement is always risky gambling and u don't know if your dick is made for it or not. You know it was not made for pe when its too late. And you know it was made for it ONLY when you stop Penis Enlargement, keep your gains and DON'T develope ED a year or 2 later.<

Penis Enlargement definitely has risks, and I try to point them out often. But, if common sense is used, and the stresses are increased slowly, giving soft tissues the time to adapt, the risks are low.

All we have to go by is anecdotal evidence from the forums. That evidence is clear. Penis Enlargement can be successful to varying degrees, for the majority of guys, safely.

>With How many documented cases of people, who did pe gained something worth mentioning (=above 0.,5") and kept a healthy erection years after Penis Enlargement can you come up with... post the links here.<

What did you have in mind? The evidence may be found in the results forums of [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/join-now.html]MOS[/words] or Thunders. I believe Thunders has a data section with a ton of results. Someone interested in Penis Enlargement should spend a good deal of time reading of those results. Then, as far as erection quality goes, all you would have to do is look at the injuries sections of the above mentioned forums. All the information is there.

>I wonder if you can come up with the thousands you mentioned in your post. I highly doubt that.<

Well, I am not going to count them up. Plus, I cannot document the thousands of guys that have emailed me, with their experience, who do not post on the forums. Plus, many years of results were deleted on the old Penis Enlargementforums. But there is still substantial information on [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/join-now.html]MOS[/words] and Thunders. Enough to get a good idea of what the situation is.

>I understand that whenever you read how someone says something against Penis Enlargement you feel attacked and protect your financial interests.<

Nope. I just hate to see someone castigating something that has meant so much to the lives of thousands of guys, including me. You are one case, not the norm.

>Please understand that this is the "injury" section of the forum and how to recover from impotence. I think I know alot more in this field than you do. Just like I would never argue with you about bib hangers.<

Well, I have documented on many occasions my problems with ED, due directly to hanging. If you had read as much as you claim, you would know that. I looked at my problems from a scientific view, and worked through them using logic. I not only fully recovered each time, but was able to continue Penis Enlargementing, reach my goals, and today have better erections that when I was in my 30's.

>truth is Penis Enlargement is potentialy ALOT more dangerous than naive people are made to belive it is. You can be following the beginner routine of the biggest pe guru and do everything 1000% correct and still end up with injury and ED.<

That is correct. Penis Enlargement is like many things, it is a risk vs reward relationship. As with Penis Enlargement surgery, or any doctor approved methods, there are risks. Such is life.

Bigger
 
Quote : "Well, I have documented on many occasions my problems with ED, due directly to hanging. If you had read as much as you claim, you would know that."

Bib , I read up tons of articles and post on injuries and ED, not on everything you ever said or did.

besides :

"
If you actually had been around for a while, you would know I have stopped making hangers on several occasions because of lack of time, and only started again when guys begged me to make them. You would also know I have never advertised, and consistantly recommend, that guys make their own hangers. You would also know I have provided instructions for guys to make their own hangers. You would also know that it is very difficult for most guys to buy a hanger, since I don't provide any credit card system through which to order."

I'm sorry, I DO know about that.However, I didn't think about that when I replied to you. Seriously I was still hurt and pissed off because of the guy who posted before you !
Man, at some time , I also made my own custom bib hanger. Good stuff.
You DO have my respect. And what you said above IS TRUE. Guess I overreacted.

Ok lets stop attacking each other and lets get back to the topic:

THIS IS VERY INTERESTING:

Quote: "I looked at my problems from a scientific view, and worked through them using logic. I not only fully recovered each time, but was able to continue Penis Enlargementing, reach my goals, and today have better erections that when I was in my "30's.

What did you do to recover from ED.How severe was you ED. Do you have any special advice for my case ?
I'm planning on getting this shit done by specialists. I already had the vein ligation surgery wich was a great success at first but then 2 weeks later , after the veins rechanneld I was back to nothing ! The specialists have cured 60 patients with a modified tecnique (read below).
---------------------------------------------------------------
ethanol injection therapy

The role of venous occlusion, along with increased
arterial inflow and corporeal smooth
muscle relaxation, is appreciated as essential in
penile erection. The failure of adequate venous occlusion
is considered to be one of the most common
causes of vasculogenic erectile dysfunction.
Surgical treatments, such as deep dorsal vein ligation,
spongiolysis, and crural ligation, have been
performed to increase the resistance of the extracorporeal
venous outflow. Such surgical procedures
have often been combined to prevent the
development of collateral veins of the corpora cavernosum;
however, the surgical invasiveness is increased
by the combined procedures.
Interventional radiology treatment for venogenic
erectile dysfunction has been previously
reported. Interventional radiology seems to
have the advantage of being less invasive than the
surgical procedures, and multiple venous channel
occlusions are achieved at once. However, embolization
of the penile vein, using coils and/or detachable
balloons, requires someone experienced in the
catheterization technique. On the other hand, with
the technique used in the present study, the insertion
of about only 2 cm in length of a flexible needle into the deep dorsal vein is needed, and occlusions
of multiple venous channels, such as the
prostatic plexus, internal pudendal veins, and inferior
vesical veins, were produced easily without
any selective embolization technique.
Ethanol is a tissue-adhesive agent used for embolization
of varicocele, renal carcinoma, hepatocellular
carcinoma, and others. To our knowledge,
no study has reported the use of ethanol
alone for the treatment of venogenic erectile dysfunction.
A highly dense ethanol injection to the
vein can create permanent venous occlusion. On
the other hand, it has been reported in pathologic
examinations that diluted ethanol does not affect
the injected vein at all. The coils, detachable balloons,
and N-butyl cyanoacrylate inserted for the
embolization of a vein have the risk of migrating to
proximal veins, but the current technique using
ethanol is free from that risk.
Suitable cases for pelvic venoablation by ethanol
injection are mostly cases of veno-occlusive erectile
dysfunction. Our experience also shows that
patients with high maintenance flow rates have
poor results because of an insufficient increase in
the resistance of the extracorporeal venous out-
flow. We could not pinpoint the differences in the
places of vein leakage between the successful and
unsuccessful cases.
The success rate of surgical treatments for venoocclusive
dysfunction gradually decreases in the
long-term follow-up. It is thought that the major
cause of failure is the opening-up of collateral, thin
veins from the corpora cavernosum. As our ethanol
technique can make multiple occlusions of the
deep dorsal vein network, including tiny veins at
once, the recovered potency may last longer than
that from other surgical treatments.
This procedure is cost-effective in comparison to
other interventional radiology procedures, because
ethanol is less expensive than other embolization
materials, such as coils, detachable balloons,
hot contrast material, sodium tetradecyl
sulfate, and N-butyl cyanoacrylate. Furthermore,
this procedure does not need a guide wire or angiographic
catheter at all.
Sildenafil has been widely used for the treatment
of erectile dysfunction since 1998, and recently, it
became the first choice for the treatment of erectile
dysfunction. Naturally, venogenic erectile dysfunction
is also often treated with sildenafil. It is
known that sildenafil induces hypotension in patients
using drugs that contain organic nitrates or
release nitric oxide. Therefore, sildenafil cannot be
used by such patients. We recommend our procedure
using ethanol for patients with veno-occlusive
dysfunction who are either unresponsive to
sildenafil or in whom sildenafil is contraindicated.
CONCLUSIONS
Our pelvic venoablation technique using ethanol
for the treatment of erectile dysfunction due to
veno-occlusive dysfunction was effective, minimally
invasive, and cost-effective. This procedure is also
characterized by the advantage that multiple occlusions
of the deep dorsal vein network, including tiny
veins, are achieved at once. We expect the long-term
success rate of this procedure will be higher than
other venous occlusion therapies because of the suppression
of collateral thin veins. However, additional
large and long-term follow-up studies are needed to
define the role of this pelvic venoablation technique
for veno-occlusive dysfunction.
REFERENCES
1. Lue TF: Physiology of penile erection and pathophysiology
of erectile dysfunction and priapism, in Walsh PC, Retik
AB, Vaughan ED Jr, et al (Eds): Campbell’s Urology, 7th ed.
Philadelphia, WB Saunders, 1998, vol 2, pp 1157–1179.
2. Lewis RW: Venous surgery for impotence. Urol Clin
North Am 15: 115–121, 1988.
3. Freedman AL, Neto FC, Mehringer CM, et al: Longterm
results of penile vein ligation for impotence from venous
leakage. J Urol 149: 1301–1303, 1993.
4. Courtheoux P, Maiza D, Henriet JP, et al: Erectile dysfunction
caused by venous leakage: treatment with detachable
balloons and coils. Radiology 161: 807–809, 1986.
5. Bookstein JJ, and Lurie AL: Transluminal penile venoablation
for impotence: a progress report. Cardiovasc Intervent
Radiol 11: 253–260, 1988.
6. Schwartz AN, Lowe M, Harley JD, et al: Preliminary
report. Penile vein occlusion therapy: selection criteria and
methods used for the transcatheter treatment of impotence
caused by venous-sinusoidal incompetence. J Urol 148: 815–
820, 1992.
7. Schild HH, Muller SC, Mildenberger P, et al: Percutaneous
penile venoablation for treatment of impotence. Cardiovasc
Intervent Radiol 16: 280–286, 1993.
8. Fowlis GA, Sidhu PS, Sager HR, et al: Preliminary
report—combined surgical and radiological penile vein occlusion
for the management of impotence caused by venoussinusoidal
incompetence. Br J Urol 74: 492–496, 1994.
9. Pes¸kirciog&#728; lu L, Tekin I, Boyvat F, et al: Embolization of
the deep dorsal vein for the treatment of erectile impotence
due to veno-occlusive dysfunction. J Urol 163: 472–475, 2000.
10. Morales A, Marshall PG, Surridge DH, et al: A new
device for diagnostic screening of nocturnal penile tumescence.
J Urol 129: 288–290, 1983.
11. Craven WM, Redmond PL, Kumpe DA, et al: Planned
delayed nephrectomy after ethanol embolization of renal carcinoma.
J Urol 146: 704–708, 1991.
12. Sayfan J, Soffer Y, and Orda R: Varicocele treatment:
prospective randomized trial of 3 methods. J Urol 148: 1447–
1449, 1992.
13. Yamakado K, Takeda K, Nishide Y, et al: Portal vein
embolization with steel coils and absolute ethanol: a comparative
experimental study with canine liver. Hepatology 22:
1812–1818, 1995.
14. Kinnison ML, Kadir S, Strandberg JD, et al: Percutaneous
spermatic vein occlusion: evaluation of sclerosing agents
in experimental animals. Radiology 161: 299–301, 1986.
15. Moriel EZ, Mehringer CM, Schwartz M, et al: Pulmonary
migration of coils inserted for treatment of erectile dysfunction
caused by venous leakage. J Urol 149: 1316–1318,
 
thefranchise said:
Man Im bout to stop Penis Enlargementing. I had been thinking about it for some time. If it is worth my erections. I havnt been gaining for shit lately, and I am just wondering if its really worth me walking around half the time with limp dick. When I do get rock hard, my CS and head don't fill up so my dick looks flat and shorter than it could be. I havnt had actuall morning wood in forever, and usually when i get random erections, its just like 50-75% full. I really hope i didnt perma fuck my penis.
Click to expand...

Do not let threads like this get you down.
If we did than I'm sure alot of us would pack it in cos someone has had bad misfortunes in their pe career.
 
Also Tbirdy, This isnt attacking you so dont think I'm doing so but could you please make it easier for us to read your posts because they are so jumbled together its very hard for me to read them.
Take spaces after paragraphs, use the quote function...anything just please make it easier to read your posts because you have alot of experience to tell and its a shame that I myself and others cant read it all, or read bits than see its hard to read and skip it.
Again this isnt a attack, but constructive critisism if you will in order for others to understand you better on these forums.

Thank you
 
I agree with Zulu. Tbirdy, your grammar and poor content structuring make it difficult to fully understand you. You seem to have a tremendous amount of information to share!

I understand that your German. That could be part our difficulty in understanding your english.
 
This thread is only loosely related to the master thread, but I'm a biology student and my understanding of human physiology is expanding all the time. I'm thinking about trying to get a formalized study on Penis Enlargement and erectile dysfunction, perhaps even as a senior project. Would anyone be willing to contribute to this idea? I appreciate any feedback anyone might have.
 
tbirdy,

>What did you do to recover from ED.How severe was you ED. Do you have any special advice for my case ?<

My ED was all nerve related. When I started Penis Enlargement, and hanging, there was very little information. The devices in use at that time were the loop, the swim cap, and the commercial Grip system (vacumn). That was it.

I started with the loop, and within the first two weeks had my first case of ED. So, I stopped, did the research, found that I was putting pressure on the nerve bundle behind the head, made a better hanger, and continued after recovery. This became a cycle.

Thankfully, each time I either overdid it, or used a hanger that was not right, the trauma to my unit was not enough to cause permanent damage. I am sure it was due to swelling of the myelin sheath surrounding the nerves. When the swelling subsided, the feeling came back. But it was scary as hell. One bout lasted for about two weeks. Eventually, I was able to come up with a system that did not cause any nerve trauma, and in fact kept the pressure away from sensitive areas.

>I'm planning on getting this shit done by specialists. I already had the vein ligation surgery wich was a great success at first but then 2 weeks later , after the veins rechanneld I was back to nothing ! The specialists have cured 60 patients with a modified tecnique (read below).<

I am sure the doctors know what they are doing. But you know, the plumbing of the penis is not that complicated. I am sure you know how it works, and that the problem could be either a lack of incoming blood, or the inability, or ineffectiveness of cutting off the return blood flow.

Before you have any more procedures done, let's look at things, and try to solve the problem without knives.

I attribute the increase in quality of my erections to one thing only: External angioplasty. Light jelqing of the outer shaft, and behind the balls jelqing of the inner shaft. I actually chronicled the increases in girth of my inner shaft, as my erections became stronger. This was from BTB jelqing alone.

Now, since your problem is blood flow related, I assume that the doctors did some tests using NO to see if it was also chemical related? IOW, are the supply vessels actually dialating?

If they are dialating, is there any other restriction on blood flow?

Even a small amount of restriction, or decrease in dialation, can cause weak erections. It may appear that the return flow is simply too great, but actually it is a lack of expansion that hinders full erection. The return flow simply cannot be cut off enough.

At any rate, I will help you however I can. The best thing to remember is to relax and figure out exactly what is happening.

Bigger
 
<<<Tbirdy, your grammar and poor content structuring make it difficult to fully understand you. You seem to have a tremendous amount of information to share!>>>

I know :( It's 100% correct and sums it up :(

I have crazy amounts of information floating around in my head at the same time. The energy to sit down and write a very big unstructured post actually comes from huge, endless deep d e s p e r a t i o n. I cry. I'm crying. Have patience with me, all your input is very valued and welcome. I'll try to structure the text better in the future.


@ BiB

I'm glad you didn't take anything that I said personally. That shows that you are really a great guy.

ED:

1. Your past ED. Nerve related. I think you fought it off , even before it developed so you never really had real ED.
It went away by itself. ED does not cure by itself, it gets worse with time.

2.
My ED. The biggest difference between yours and mine is: Mine developed subsequently after 2 injuries/traumas to the erect penis. I NEVER ever (up to this day) had the chance to understand or pinpoint WHAT exactly got damaged. See ? This is the reason for my chaos in the head ? I don't know the enemy, I'm trapped in the dark. You logically concluded "its the nerves behind the head" and stopped chronically injuring them. I don't know what is injured.

In my case , I only have my memmory as aid or as something to compare to , as in : How the penis used to be, and how it is now. Besides that , I only have the symptoms = insufficient erection+ bigger, more veins. How I'm thinking is :

Is it the arteries ?
Is it the veins ?
Nerves ?
Venous leak ?
cavernous leak ?
degenrated muscle cells in the cavernous bodys ?
Fibrosis in the cavernous body ?
Or what comes closest to my situation : A bit of all of the above mentioned.

So what therapy should I go with ?

There is revascularisation surgery.= Connecting arteries to veins. = more inflow = more pressure = should be a hard dick after the op. But what if its the nerves ? The nerves control the dialation of the arteries, if the signal doesn't arrive at the arterie = no success of the revascularisation surgery.
Also, what if its the veins ? Or venous leak ? remember erection hardness happens because almost ALL bloodoutflow is trapped. So if its the veins/nerves/leakage = no success of the revascularisation surgery.

On the other hand :

What if it is the arteries ? Arterisklerosis ?! And everything else works fine. The veins are all ok and the spongy tissues and the nerves too ? Then revascularization surgery or hooking the main artery that leads to the penis to a even bigger arterie is THE option, and the way to go.

Nerves ? Nerve surgery ? Haven't found ANYTHING on nerve surgery yet. In bibs case the nerves were "dulled" and returned to normal. I know nerves can regenrates long as the axons in the spine are present. But what if a nerve is cut. (like probably in my case) After this vein ligation surgery, My whole upperside of the dick is still completely numb (its been 2 month). I was told it takes 3 month and then it will return to normal. I don#t believe in that. Correct me if I'm wrong, if a nerve gets cut , then the distant half will die off and be absorbed by the body, UNLESS you very quickly after the cut, connect the ends. Then, after 12-16 month the nerve will regenerate and you might get a weak feeling back. Thats what I remember about nerves.

Penis Vein ligation :

Well since one of my symptoms was alot bigger veins , wich developed after the injury, and I read in many scientific articles, even ONE damaged vein could be the cause for complete erektile dysfunction , I figured this is the way to go.
Prior,
I had full duplex sonography , wich went terribly wrong , and eventhough I had a prostaglandin injection , my dick didn't turn hard by itself. (sign of venous leak) I had to manually stimulate myself to a complete erection , that instantly faded away once I stopped the severe stimulation . I also squeezed my pc muscle like crazy...so by no means it was natural spontanious or drug induced erection. the doctor measured inbetween my jerk sessions, and said:
"The 4 arteries could be identified and they worked, however there seems to be not "quite" enough blood-inflow. However this could be due to : Either the horrific scenario : me jerking off , then calling the doc back in, then measuring , then erection gone , then repeat...not natural and not stimulating or maybe because of a ill connection , where the arterie goes directly into a vein directly bloodoutflow from that arterie.(highly unlikely though)

To really investigate what is going on within the penis, you need to perform radiology and cavernosographie.
You get to fat needles in each of your corpus cavernosum , the needles are attached to a pump, this pump fill the chambers with 50%saline and 50% contrast agent , and the doctors x-ray the dick..because ofthe contrast agent , the EXACT position of a potential venous leak can be pinpoined (they exactly see the blood-outflow). Sounds good , eh ? Why did i not choose to do this: Potentually dangerous and invasive procedere. One side effect can be inflammation of all chambers and complete fibrosis thereafter = complete impotence. Not a good scenario, rare though.

Thats why I talked the docotor into, doing the vein ligation surgery WITHOUT the cavernosographie.

Ok, the surgery :

A first step into the right direction. A first step into the light. 1 week after the surgery, I had AMAZING results to say the least. Spontanious morning wood for the first time ever ! The CS filled up to its max my inner Penis got huge , my overall girth at the base increased to 6 inches at erection, where it never naturally was in my whole life. It was like, I finally filled out the spce that I created though Penis Enlargement. My head was HARD. For the first time in 2 years it was really really hard...

unfortunatly , as quickly as all of this came it went away again. 2 and 3d week, I noticed new veins poppin out everywhere. either bridge veins from the cut veins , or new fullsize veins. of the 10-15 veins that the doctor ligated - only 3-4 COMPLETLY turned into full length scarr strings , and really were shut down for good. The only effect that I kept after this 3 week was a still harder head and a more engorged CS, but even that is gone now.

I have the same situation as before. I can get erect ANY time, by severe stimulation of the penis underside , while clamping my legs/ass muscles and pc muscle..as soon as i let of the pc pressure or stop the stimulation, it goes down 2 nothing ! Really , really fast. No standing power at all.

Oh wait , my situation is even worse now. I have the complete upperside numb. I don't know if nerves were cut that control the arteries...I don't know :( I was told that the doctor took EXTRA care, and tried NOT to injure the precious nerves...damn ! My orgasm is ALOT weaker now..ALOT ALOT..before , even with the ED I had powerfull, satisfying orgasms , now its not really worth the struggle...

I have a tens unit. With this thing you can train your smooth muscle cells. it works by stimulating the nerves in the penis, and these nerves make the muscle cells react and contract. Before the OP , when I used this tens on my upperside, it was tingling and contracting. Now it doesn't. The only nerves that i DO feel is the most important, that goes along the downside from the frenulum to the prostate. But even in that nerve I have less feeling.

The scar and the tissue around the scar is still swollen a bit, maybe this swelling is still pushing on the upper nerves like in BIBS case and the nerves get numbed, maybe after more time the swelling will be gone completely and the nerves will react again ? I don't know. I hope so.



Next steps ? Well, there gotta be a overriding factor !
And in my case I think its the veins.
I had huge success with it. And it all failed because the veins were not closed full length. With the technique described in the upper post , they can close the deep dorsal and its channel veins for good, they can also close the topical , rechanneled veins for good. I hope to get the results back , that I used 2 have.
Is this logical. ???

Only irreversible downside is : I won#t have the option of the normal revascularisation surgery any more.

I seriously don't care bout the weak orgasms or the numb upperside , if only I can get back the results from the first op , permanent. I think I still will have the option to hook the main penis arterie to a bigger one to increase the pressure later. This is very invasive and VERY VERY dangerous, though...probably to expensive and no insurance covers it. The ethanol sklerosing thing is cheap and my insurance will cover it.

Does this sound logical to u , or am I missing something ?

@ Bib again :

Thats what in my head. You also got me thinking , that since you DID know your problem and I don't, maybe I shouldn't go for a overriding factor solution and shoot in the dark agan. Maybe I should take the risk and have a cavernosographie ? Then again , if I decide to go with the sklerosing OP , I don*'t need the exact location , everything will be taken care off.

What you definetly inspired me to do: Getting the arteries checked through angiology, and getting all the nerves checked , if they still respond, before I do any more operations.

Thx alot ,

TBiRDY
 
I keep returning to this theory that, horrifyingly, makes more and more sense to me.

I'm wondering if we damaged our smooth muscles or erectile tissue with Penis Enlargement and the damage scarred. Scar tissue doesn't work like the tissue it replaces. For example, after a heart attack, scar tissue forms in the affected cells. They don't regain their heart-beating functionality. If our smooth muscles were damaged and suffered some scarring, they wouldn't relax completely when NO is released in the brain, impairing the ability of the spongy blood vessels to dilate and make a penis rigid. Scar tissue can be somewhat flexible, though, and so this might explain how with heavy masturbation you and I are able to get a better hard on. Are there any ways other than biopsies to determine if any scar tissue is present in the smooth muscles of the penis?

As I continue this line of thought, it makes sense that scar tissue replaces the damaged tissue when I consider how my flacid penis hangs 1.5 inches or so longer than it used to before Penis Enlargement: The scar tissue is relatively inflexible, and so the smooth muscle isn't able to completely contract in the relaxed, flacid state.

What do you guys think? I've been reading that smooth muscle has a limited ability to regenerate, so maybe it isn't all gloom and doom.
 
I need to qualify something I just posted here:

The analogy of the heart I used is bad. Heart is cardiac muscle, which is distinctly different from smooth muscle. I'm just sorry for the poor reference.

I seem to have been recovering a little bit from my more profound ED. I stopped drinking coffee once or twice a day and switched to green tea. Also, I have been taking the anti-depressent celexa (15-20 mg) for 4 years now. Still gotta see that Urologist on the 13th.

Does anyone else believe their erections are weaker, less frequent, and more difficult to maintain after several years of on and off routines? Bib, to provide some information for you, I only feel like I've experienced any kind of numbness for a few days, maybe 5 at the most, when I first started Penis Enlargement'ing. I guess that doesn't make it impossible that my erectile dysfunction isn't nerve related.

I appreciate any feedback.
 
tbirdy,

>1. Your past ED. Nerve related. I think you fought it off , even before it developed so you never really had real ED.<

Well, poor erections are poor erections. The causes are many, and mine were bad. I surely did not think there was no problem at the time.

>It went away by itself. ED does not cure by itself, it gets worse with time.<

Well, some surely do. If the cause is blunt force trauma, and you allow the tissues to heal, and not provide anymore trauma, then it will probably heal.

But I understand what you mean. Often, a vascular problem can be permanent, unless some plumbing work is done.

>2.
My ED. The biggest difference between yours and mine is: Mine developed subsequently after 2 injuries/traumas to the erect penis. I NEVER ever (up to this day) had the chance to understand or pinpoint WHAT exactly got damaged. See ? This is the reason for my chaos in the head ? I don't know the enemy, I'm trapped in the dark. You logically concluded "its the nerves behind the head" and stopped chronically injuring them. I don't know what is injured.<

Can you give the general area of ORIGINAL injury?

>Is it the arteries ?<

From your description, it surely could be. Have you tried any BTB jelqing? I know that you are shy of Penis Enlargement now, but this is something that could really help. It is not going to damage you any further, and could provide a much greater blood supply. A wild ass guess, but I get the feeling this is what you need. More blood getting into the chambers.

It may also help with any restrictions (plaque) in the feeder vessels.

>Is it the veins ?<

Only from the standpoint of the feeder vessels not providing enough blood to get the initial clamping of the return vessels (veins). If the veins are not clamping off, then no or weak erections.

>Nerves ?<

You respond to stimulation, so probably not. But you have numbness on the bottom of your shaft, which could screw with your head, limiting NO production, and dialation of feeder vessels.

>Venous leak ?<

Probably due to weak inflow as stated above.

>cavernous leak ?<

Any bulges or odd formations in your erections? If not, then no.

>degenrated muscle cells in the cavernous bodys ?<

No.

>Fibrosis in the cavernous body <

Find anything from palpation? Any unevenness in your erections? One chamber larger or smaller than the others, or than normal?

>Or what comes closest to my situation : A bit of all of the above mentioned.<

I don't think so. I think your problem is specific, but you are taking a shotgun approach, trying to get a fix. Better to sit back, analize, and come up with a game plan. Then, go about things in a progressive manner, addressing one thing at a time.

If it were me, I would try some BTB jelqing, and try to get a full, sustained erection. You are getting weak erections now. Try to get more blood flow, and see if you can get a higher quality erection.

Most guys do not realize the minute differences in what constitutes a rock hard erection, and a weak one. It does not take much to disrupt a good erection.

Think of it this way: What happens when guys get priapism, an erection that will not subside? No stimulation, no NO production, nothing, but the erection will not go down. This is simply a huge blood flow, causing complete shut off of all return blood, and therefore the erection cannot go down, even when inflow is not there. Like a very tight cock ring.

But the overall physiology is not that different from a normal erection. The converse is also true: The overall physiology is not that different when you experience weak erections. If you supply even a bit more inflow, it could solve your problem completely.

This is what I attribute to my better erections. I do BTB jelqing a few times per month, just to keep things in shape, make sure the inflow is there, and my erections are better than in my 30's. Not my 20's, but I do not expect miracles.

>There is revascularisation surgery.= Connecting arteries to veins. = more inflow = more pressure = should be a hard dick after the op. But what if its the nerves ? The nerves control the dialation of the arteries, if the signal doesn't arrive at the arterie = no success of the revascularisation surgery.<

As I said above, I do not think it is the nerves. You react to stimulation. You may have less feeling on the bottom of your shaft, but not too much overall numbness.

As far as more surgery, I would get more information first. Any more cutting would be a final option.

>Also, what if its the veins ? Or venous leak ? remember erection hardness happens because almost ALL bloodoutflow is trapped. So if its the veins/nerves/leakage = no success of the revascularisation surgery.<

You are able to get a partial, or weak erection. Your problem is the lack of inflow, not the ablilty to cut off outflow.

>What if it is the arteries ? Arterisklerosis ?! And everything else works fine. The veins are all ok and the spongy tissues and the nerves too ? Then revascularization surgery or hooking the main artery that leads to the penis to a even bigger arterie is THE option, and the way to go.<

Or manual angioplasty, BTB jelqing may work! Try it!

>Nerves ? Nerve surgery ? Haven't found ANYTHING on nerve surgery yet. In bibs case the nerves were "dulled" and returned to normal. I know nerves can regenrates long as the axons in the spine are present. But what if a nerve is cut. (like probably in my case) After this vein ligation surgery, My whole upperside of the dick is still completely numb (its been 2 month). I was told it takes 3 month and then it will return to normal. I don#t believe in that. Correct me if I'm wrong, if a nerve gets cut , then the distant half will die off and be absorbed by the body, UNLESS you very quickly after the cut, connect the ends. Then, after 12-16 month the nerve will regenerate and you might get a weak feeling back. Thats what I remember about nerves.<

It depends on how close the ends are together. Also if the myelin sheath is also cut, which in surgery it usually is. I believe nerves grow at about one cm per month.

>"The 4 arteries could be identified and they worked, however there seems to be not "quite" enough blood-inflow. However this could be due to : Either the horrific scenario : me jerking off , then calling the doc back in, then measuring , then erection gone , then repeat...not natural and not stimulating or maybe because of a ill connection , where the arterie goes directly into a vein directly bloodoutflow from that arterie.(highly unlikely though)<

Hang your hat on this. Poor blood inflow. From what I have read here, that is your problem. Now, how that relates to your injury, I do not know, especially without more information on your injury. But you need to address the inflow.

With BTB jelqing, and other manual and mental stimulation, you need to see if you can get an above normal erection. If so, you have found your problem.

>To really investigate what is going on within the penis, you need to perform radiology and cavernosographie.
You get to fat needles in each of your corpus cavernosum , the needles are attached to a pump, this pump fill the chambers with 50%saline and 50% contrast agent , and the doctors x-ray the dick..because ofthe contrast agent , the EXACT position of a potential venous leak can be pinpoined (they exactly see the blood-outflow). Sounds good , eh ? Why did i not choose to do this: Potentually dangerous and invasive procedere. One side effect can be inflammation of all chambers and complete fibrosis thereafter = complete impotence. Not a good scenario, rare though.<

Hold off on thoughts of this.

>A first step into the right direction. A first step into the light. 1 week after the surgery, I had AMAZING results to say the least. Spontanious morning wood for the first time ever ! The CS filled up to its max my inner Penis got huge , my overall girth at the base increased to 6 inches at erection, where it never naturally was in my whole life. It was like, I finally filled out the spce that I created though Penis Enlargement. My head was HARD. For the first time in 2 years it was really really hard...

unfortunatly , as quickly as all of this came it went away again. 2 and 3d week, I noticed new veins poppin out everywhere. either bridge veins from the cut veins , or new fullsize veins. of the 10-15 veins that the doctor ligated - only 3-4 COMPLETLY turned into full length scarr strings , and really were shut down for good. The only effect that I kept after this 3 week was a still harder head and a more engorged CS, but even that is gone now.<

OK, what changed in those 2-3 weeks? Or rather, what happened after the surgery to provide better erections? Any veins that you see in the shaft are irrelevant to erection quality. It only matters if the outflow is cut off, inside your body, from the dialation of the inflow vessels, and the increased blood pressure in that area. New veins in the shaft make no difference.

>I have the same situation as before. I can get erect ANY time, by severe stimulation of the penis underside , while clamping my legs/ass muscles and pc muscle..as soon as i let of the pc pressure or stop the stimulation, it goes down 2 nothing ! Really , really fast. No standing power at all.<

This is great, and shows what I mean. Several things are required in an erection. The stimulation provides dialation of the inflow vessels. Then, sufficient blood flow must be there to fill the dialated vessels. Then, the dialation and blood flow must be sufficient to increase pressure against the outflow vessels, to therefore cut off outflow.

You said, "by severe stimulation of the penis underside , while clamping my legs/ass muscles and pc muscle". What does this mean? You got 100% or greater stimulation, which provided max dialation, and then clamped your legs ass, PC, to attempt to restrict outflow. What is missing? Obviously is is blood supply. There is a restriction in blood inflow, which BTB jelqing may address in grand fashion.

>Oh wait , my situation is even worse now. I have the complete upperside numb. I don't know if nerves were cut that control the arteries...I don't know :( I was told that the doctor took EXTRA care, and tried NOT to injure the precious nerves...damn ! My orgasm is ALOT weaker now..ALOT ALOT..before , even with the ED I had powerfull, satisfying orgasms , now its not really worth the struggle...<

I think this shotgun approach makes things snowball. You need to sit back, relax, and take things one at a time. Work on blood inflow first. When/if you feel your blood supply is sufficient, then you can look at other things. But above all, relax, heal from the procedures, and then go about things objectively.

>I have a tens unit. With this thing you can train your smooth muscle cells. it works by stimulating the nerves in the penis, and these nerves make the muscle cells react and contract. Before the OP , when I used this tens on my upperside, it was tingling and contracting. Now it doesn't. The only nerves that i DO feel is the most important, that goes along the downside from the frenulum to the prostate. But even in that nerve I have less feeling.<

Put the tens unit away.

>The scar and the tissue around the scar is still swollen a bit, maybe this swelling is still pushing on the upper nerves like in BIBS case and the nerves get numbed, maybe after more time the swelling will be gone completely and the nerves will react again ? I don't know. I hope so.<

Yes. Even a little swelling of the myelin sheath will interrupt the electrical signal in the nerves. Relax and heal.

>Next steps ? Well, there gotta be a overriding factor !
And in my case I think its the veins.<

I don't think so. Without more information, I think it is blood supply, arteries, amount of available inflow blood.

>I had huge success with it. And it all failed because the veins were not closed full length. With the technique described in the upper post , they can close the deep dorsal and its channel veins for good, they can also close the topical , rechanneled veins for good. I hope to get the results back , that I used 2 have.
Is this logical. ???<

It is logical, but does not address the problem. Even a trickle of incoming blood can be sufficient to produce an erection, if all outgoing blood is cut off by drastic means, either a cock ring, or tieing off all outgoing veins. But that is not a solution. If you can increase the incoming blood you can clamp off the outgoing veins naturally, and have better erections.

>I seriously don't care bout the weak orgasms or the numb upperside , if only I can get back the results from the first op , permanent. I think I still will have the option to hook the main penis arterie to a bigger one to increase the pressure later. This is very invasive and VERY VERY dangerous, though...probably to expensive and no insurance covers it. The ethanol sklerosing thing is cheap and my insurance will cover it.

Does this sound logical to u , or am I missing something ?<

Don't even consider any more surgery until you know EXACTLY what is happening, EXACTLY what the problem is, and address it. Everything to do with the veins is a moot point, if there is not suffcient incoming blood. This does not mean only open healthy arteries, but also the amount of blood available to flow through those arteries.

>Thats what in my head. You also got me thinking , that since you DID know your problem and I don't, maybe I shouldn't go for a overriding factor solution and shoot in the dark agan. Maybe I should take the risk and have a cavernosographie ? Then again , if I decide to go with the sklerosing OP , I don*'t need the exact location , everything will be taken care off.<

No. Sit back, relax, and heal. Vit B complex is needed for regeneration of nerves. Get some and take it. That's it. Then, please take my advice and try the BTB jelqing. Very easy to do. See if you can increase the incoming blood.

After a couple months, re-evaluate and see where you are. And once again, do not do anything until you know for sure what is needed, and how it should come out.

>What you definetly inspired me to do: Getting the arteries checked through angiology, and getting all the nerves checked , if they still respond, before I do any more operations.<

But don't do that until you have healed, and are sure you have enough blood to feed the arteries of the shaft.

Bigger
 
orbital,

>I'm wondering if we damaged our smooth muscles or erectile tissue with Penis Enlargement and the damage scarred. Scar tissue doesn't work like the tissue it replaces. For example, after a heart attack, scar tissue forms in the affected cells. They don't regain their heart-beating functionality. If our smooth muscles were damaged and suffered some scarring, they wouldn't relax completely when NO is released in the brain, impairing the ability of the spongy blood vessels to dilate and make a penis rigid. Scar tissue can be somewhat flexible, though, and so this might explain how with heavy masturbation you and I are able to get a better hard on. Are there any ways other than biopsies to determine if any scar tissue is present in the smooth muscles of the penis?<

You may or may not understand the purpose and function of the smooth muscle that lines the vessels of the three chambers. It is to dialate the vessels, allowing for greater volume in the chambers, to expand to the limits of the tunica, and produce an erection.

Smooth muscle does not produce scar tissue to any great extent. Tears are easily healed, and generally will conform to the approximate condition of the original tissue. Further, it is very hard to tear that particular smooth muscle. It is well protected.

Then, if a guy gets regular, daily erections, the higher internal blood pressure against the smooth muscle will train it to heal in a normal state. At any rate, the higher internal blood pressure will not be affected by any small aberations in the smooth muscle.

Further, if you had internal chamber damage, it should result in lopsided erections, one chamber being obviously larger or fuller than another, or bulges, etc. Plus, you should be able to actually palpate and find any damaged tissue.

Much more likely to cause problems is a tear and resulting scar tissue in the tunica, which is generally the cause of peyronies.

>As I continue this line of thought, it makes sense that scar tissue replaces the damaged tissue when I consider how my flacid penis hangs 1.5 inches or so longer than it used to before Penis Enlargement: The scar tissue is relatively inflexible, and so the smooth muscle isn't able to completely contract in the relaxed, flacid state.<

Once again, that would not be the smooth muscle, but rather the tunica. Flaccid hang is dependent on the length of the tunica, and the relative amount of elastin within the collagenous tissues. A shower vs a grower. More likely, in your case, either the tunica became relatively longer, or you effectively lengthened the elastin fibers of your shaft.

>What do you guys think? I've been reading that smooth muscle has a limited ability to regenerate, so maybe it isn't all gloom and doom.<

Smooth muscle regenerates as well as any tissue in the body, about the same as striated muscle. Collagenous tissues take much longer to heal, and are more likely to form scar tissue.

Bigger
 
Bib. I love you ! Not in a gay way (I'm straight). But because you took extra extra time to adress my problem and chaos, despite me (kinda) insulting you couple posts above.
Man, pls stick with me on this one for a little longer.
I have something new to add and something to clear up , because I feel you got it wrong. I definetly need your consultation, 2 brains are better than one. Maybe together we will find the missing clue !
-------------------------------------------------------------------
quote:
"Can you give the general area of ORIGINAL injury?"

Yes, I can give the exact locations. First injury. 2 years ago. Affected area, left chamber , 1 inch away from base. Resulted in shortening and size loss in that chamber and deviation. Did alot of Penis Enlargement and got all of the girth back and straightend everything out. (Remember my "cure uneven chambers thread?") No big signs of ED. Then second injury. Bottomside, 2 inches away from base. Mostly affected the CS-chamber, wich never filled up as good after the injury including the head.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Ok now the most important thing that we need to get a "common" / same understanding off :

Venous leak. And what EXACTLY it means.

I understand that your hinting at weak blood-inflow and that more inflow should cure my condition. You are right ofcourse. However, its totally unrealistic, no btb jelquing will ever build up enough internal pressure to counter the outflow from the LEAK ! Thats why i flex my (ultra-strong) pc muscles, clamp my ass together, move my upper legs together and cross them to get it up...more pressure !

Ok now back to the understanding of the leak. Once you understand u will see everything in new perspective :

Study this picture exactly. Its basically from any part of the cavernous chambers. It works the same everywhere, but the head.

HEALTHY ERECTION, NO LEAK !

Left is flaccid and right is erect=no outflow (or 99,9% restricted)
Notice how the expansion of the spongy tissue CLAMPS OFF and restricts the vein !
A venous leak is NOT necessary a damaged vein, or very big vein. A venous leak is in fact the DAMAGED tissue AROUND the exact point where the vein enters the spongy tissue. Because of that damaged area (even if its small) this particular vein does NOT get restricted, EVER. Even if you have a perfectly healthy dick everywhere else. Healthy nerves and arteries.
Understand the importance of this ? Understand why vein ligations, revasculariszatio surgery mostly fail ß its because of this.
I think this directly realtes to me.

I DO have inflow. And you are right, as long as there is very good restriction (everywhere) you could fill a dick up to a rock hard erection, even if you had 1 tiny weak arterie and not 4 of them.

YOU ARE RIGHT ON THE MONEY WiTH THIS (just add this new information into the mix)

QUOTE :
"""OK, what changed in those 2-3 weeks? Or rather, what happened after the surgery to provide better erections? Any veins that you see in the shaft are irrelevant to erection quality. It only matters if the outflow is cut off, inside your body, from the dialation of the inflow vessels, and the increased blood pressure in that area. New veins in the shaft make no difference."""

The reason for success and failure is very simple :
Initial success was because they WERE LUCKY and did LIGATE the very exact vein that originated from the venous leak (damged tissue area). The problem is : They fixed the vein at the base, and my speculation is, since a vein is interconnected with other veins and has many branches, the vein simply rechanneled , somehwere between the VENOUS LEAK location and the cut end ! Once that happened, the outflow was unstopped.

So logically, to shut a venous leak down for good , you have to SHUT down the VEIN, FULL LENGTH , from the exact ENTER point into the leak , down the full length up to the base. Only then this LEAK is fixed/patched for good !

Ligation surgery can't do that fro obvious reasons, so there is only the option of attempting full length vein sklerosis.

THIS is the over-riding factor. I should be able to get 100% rock again even with my present arterial and nerve condition. The first 2 weeks (post) showed CLEARLY , that I do have what it takes to FILL a dick , but I don't have what it takes to KEEP the blood where it is.

Ok last but not least , with the new understanding of VENOUS LEAK in mind, you also got to understand , I didn't have a 100% rock hard erection in over a year. I mean really really rock hard with hardly any outflow.

So EVEN if the DO find the location of the venous leak , and even if the manage to sklerose the vein that comes out of that area. The blood chooses the pass of least resistance , just like water under pressure. A new venous leak CAN possibly open up ( if there is more damaged tissue in my dick ) That would have to get fixed too.

Man , just compare my dick to a sinking ship...(only with the (fluid-)flow , everything is in reverse :) )

I need to get the holes , all the weak spots PATCHED/FIXED in my love boat, so that I can sail again.

I guess , with this in mind , I don't have too much choice , rather than taking the crazy risk of a cavernosographie. I wonder if its theoretically possible to inject a contrast agents through the artries , leading into the penis , rather than hooking the penis to a pump. All they need to see is where the blood leaves/leaks at 1000% erection.

I guess thats the problem. I can't get a 1000% erection , naturally , with stimulation , injection , viagra..I guess this is why the hook peoples dicks to pumps, because they can PUMP SO MUCH into the dick (similar to what you were hintin at with the btb and the more inflow to fix my solution) so that the regular outflow is countered and the biggest hole (pressure finds its easy way) as in vENOUS LEAK is easily to identify.
--------------------------------------------------------------

Man In fact , i just had another lighning strike.
The area where I injured myself , is also the area where I got the fat veins. I know why:

EXCESSIVE PRESSURE ON THE VEINS oveR A LONG Penis EnlargementRIOD !!!! In a healthy erection , there is hardly any pressure on the veins...remember the picture...the veins blood access is restricted, so no pressure. In my case , I had an injury , so after that, the vein had full access to the blood and the pressure of the whole erection was pushing out of one hole (the venous leak location) where , after some time , the walls of the vein got fucked up. Same situation as with those veins (in affected people) , that run FROM the calves to the upper leg, fat, snaky , and hurtfull) There , they perform vein stripping , to get rid of this condition. Stripping leaves the same result as full length sklerosing. Cutting leads to rechanneling !


ok gotta go sleep over this...

i need to find a way of finding these leaks at minimal danger for the dick , and a way of shutting them for good !!!
 
Very interesting post guys,I wil reread when I am not exhausted.Just what does cause ED anyway? I neverhave had a problem with ED,now that I have got this pemchant for Viagra I don't even worry that it will ever cause me problems.There were times whith out viagra when I am tired that I will go soft,but I feel the use of viagra even in small doses causes nocturnal erections which I feel keep the ole pipes clean,so to speak.Bib.and Tbirdy what are your feelings on this?I do know that the viagra helps my blood pressure to stay within a safe realm,which I feel helps my erections,but like Bib I feel there are times when my erection could be better(with out the viagra)with viagra(even 25 mg my erections are rock hard and larger than the norm,I feel that P.E. has helped me to gain and inchand a half in both length and girth.I mean vein bulging erections that are like I hae a clamp on,what do y'all think?
 
Yep, great info, I am learning a lot. It's a good thing this thread didn't go to hell when it could have a few posts ago. Goes to show true maturity and good will from you.

I hope you nail this thing, good luck tbirdy.
 
Pupper, I know of 2 double-blind randomized studys performed on guys.
1 study was performed for 1 year , the other for 3 month.

1 study summery (its in german so i translate short version for u)

They took 140 guys and devided them into 2 groups. All of these guys had mild to medium ED. The first group was given 50 mg viagra each day,prior to sleep, no skipping days, for the time of one year. The second group was randomly given viagra, every couple of days for one year.
Both grups were closely examinated and had to stop all viagra intake after the year. The were checked and rechecked 1 month and 6 month after the study-year.

Results :
In the first group 58,8% regained a completely normal erection after the year and kept it without taking viagra after the year.
In the second group only 9,7% regained their erections.
In group 1 the systolic arterial flow ((PSV)) increased
from 29,4 + 9,8 cm/s to 38,9 + 10,3 cm/s !!!!!
In the second group a non siginificant improvement of + 3,0 cm/s was observed.

Those guys from group 1, who completely regained their erections and kept them for 6 month without viagra intake , were examined again for 6 month of no viagra intake (a total of 1 year without viagra) 95 % of these guys kept their regained erections !!!!

observation and explanation :

It was observed that daily, evening intake of 50 mg viagra , significantly prolonged nocturnal and morning erections.
A well train smooth muscle tissue , with many muscle cells and low collagen is very good for the erection. In fact this daily intake lead to a normalizing of mild and medium ED.
-----------------------------------------------------------

So thats why I advised orbital , who is suffering from mild ED to take the viagra daily in the evening. No skipping days!!!!!! I myself am currently on the same regime. However the studys also says , that this viagra training wll only work for guys with mostly intakt blood and vein vessels. I guess that means no luck for me...I still take the chance :)

But all you young guys with mild ED should instantly set yourself on this regime and follow it in painfull detail.
Forgot to mention , those 140 guys who were examined were 40 - 50 years old. So if old fucks can regain their erections, sure as hell you can !!!!!!
 
T,I can tell you from the standpoint of a 43 year old man (me)with a 40 year old wife,My wife in her sexual peak, myself also having a high libido but sometimes having to work long hours(and I'm in business for myself ),when you own the company you are tyed to it.Viagra taken reularlly has had very good effects for me not just in the bedroom but with rock solid morning erections,lower blood pressure and mindblowing orgasms,combine that with being highly sexual (lots of sex)in a monogamous relationship(which we both have a lot of love and trust for each other)It works,injuries or no injuries,I never neede the stuff before,but after tryig it,like bib was saying "erection quality"was betond compare,I did'nt get this hard when I was a teenager.Viagra is a very good product I feel,even with the reports of blindness and hairy palms(LOL).Viagra does not give you the libido though I feel that the right supplements,diet,exercise(which I don't get much of except in the bedroom)and a positive mental outlook give a person libido,viagra is an erection enhancing drug,that has a dual benefit of lowering blood pressure and enhancing erections.Also if you get morning wood you know your body is healthy.I'll pm you that info we talked about later,real busynow got to go,I'll write tonite(pm)
 
tbirdy,

>I have something new to add and something to clear up , because I feel you got it wrong. I definetly need your consultation, 2 brains are better than one. Maybe together we will find the missing clue !<

Well, I think we are looking at a matter of degree. You may not understand exactly how an erection is formed, but you have a general idea. I feel like you are discounting the importance of blood supply to getting a good erection. I still do not see where you know what you are working with.


>>"Can you give the general area of ORIGINAL injury?"

Yes, I can give the exact locations. First injury. 2 years ago. Affected area, left chamber , 1 inch away from base. Resulted in shortening and size loss in that chamber and deviation. Did alot of Penis Enlargement and got all of the girth back and straightend everything out. (Remember my "cure uneven chambers thread?") No big signs of ED. Then second injury. Bottomside, 2 inches away from base. Mostly affected the CS-chamber, wich never filled up as good after the injury including the head.<<

OK, now how did the injury occur? Trauma, bruising, etc? What does the injury look like? Give as much information as possible.


>Venous leak. And what EXACTLY it means.

I understand that your hinting at weak blood-inflow and that more inflow should cure my condition. You are right ofcourse. However, its totally unrealistic, no btb jelquing will ever build up enough internal pressure to counter the outflow from the LEAK !<

I am not saying you are wrong, but how do you know that? The amounts of pressure we are talking about, and the difference between a weak erection, and a good erection, are minute. It does not take much.

>Thats why i flex my (ultra-strong) pc muscles, clamp my ass together, move my upper legs together and cross them to get it up...more pressure !<

That does not do much to cut down on return blood flow. It is just enough to help. Greater blood flow can do the same thing. Tell me this: Have you ever used a cock ring? If so, how did it work? How long did it take to get an erection? Relatively hard or easy?

>Ok now back to the understanding of the leak. Once you understand u will see everything in new perspective :

Study this picture exactly. Its basically from any part of the cavernous chambers. It works the same everywhere, but the head.

HEALTHY ERECTION, NO LEAK !

Left is flaccid and right is erect=no outflow (or 99,9% restricted)
Notice how the expansion of the spongy tissue CLAMPS OFF and restricts the vein !
A venous leak is NOT necessary a damaged vein, or very big vein. A venous leak is in fact the DAMAGED tissue AROUND the exact point where the vein enters the spongy tissue. Because of that damaged area (even if its small) this particular vein does NOT get restricted, EVER. Even if you have a perfectly healthy dick everywhere else. Healthy nerves and arteries.
Understand the importance of this ? Understand why vein ligations, revasculariszatio surgery mostly fail ß its because of this.
I think this directly realtes to me.<<

I do understand all of that. But it is not a one shot deal. There is more than one opportunity to cut off return blood flow, and if the artery dialation, and incoming blood supply are great enough, it will still cut off return flow, even in damaged tissues. That is simple physics. If you can do it manually, or with a cock ring, you can probably do it naturally, with a greater blood supply.

>I DO have inflow. And you are right, as long as there is very good restriction (everywhere) you could fill a dick up to a rock hard erection, even if you had 1 tiny weak arterie and not 4 of them.<

But how confident are you in your blood supply, and why do you have this confidence? Did the Dr do any tests?

>>The reason for success and failure is very simple :
Initial success was because they WERE LUCKY and did LIGATE the very exact vein that originated from the venous leak (damged tissue area). The problem is : They fixed the vein at the base, and my speculation is, since a vein is interconnected with other veins and has many branches, the vein simply rechanneled , somehwere between the VENOUS LEAK location and the cut end ! Once that happened, the outflow was unstopped.<

I do not think so. Especially not in two weeks. I believe you need to totally rethink this vein thing, and do not assume that cutting off return flow is your fix.

>So logically, to shut a venous leak down for good , you have to SHUT down the VEIN, FULL LENGTH , from the exact ENTER point into the leak , down the full length up to the base. Only then this LEAK is fixed/patched for good !<

No, this is not how it works. You can shut the return flow off, at any point up to the main veins within the body, and acheive an erection, as long as there is sufficient blood flow into the shaft. You are putting way too much attention into the return veins. I do not think that is your problem at all.

BTW, take everything your Dr says with a grain of salt. Remember, he does not eat unless you have a problem.

Further, there is a lot of info on the web about venous leakage. Most of what I saw suggested treating by increasing the incoming blood flow FIRST. Most by taking Viagra, Cialas, or Caverjet. But I am thinking a couple weeks of BTB jelqing will fix your problem.

>THIS is the over-riding factor. I should be able to get 100% rock again even with my present arterial and nerve condition. The first 2 weeks (post) showed CLEARLY , that I do have what it takes to FILL a dick , but I don't have what it takes to KEEP the blood where it is.<

This is the one point I can see that fully supports your position. That you get an erection, and then slowly loose it, does mean something. But still, with greater internal pressure, the return blood can be more effectively cut off, and the erection stay.

>>Ok last but not least , with the new understanding of VENOUS LEAK in mind, you also got to understand , I didn't have a 100% rock hard erection in over a year. I mean really really rock hard with hardly any outflow.<<

That is not unusual with decreased inflow also.

>So EVEN if the DO find the location of the venous leak , and even if the manage to sklerose the vein that comes out of that area. The blood chooses the pass of least resistance , just like water under pressure. A new venous leak CAN possibly open up ( if there is more damaged tissue in my dick ) That would have to get fixed too.<

I just do not think so.

>>Man , just compare my dick to a sinking ship...(only with the (fluid-)flow , everything is in reverse )

I need to get the holes , all the weak spots PATCHED/FIXED in my love boat, so that I can sail again.<<<

NO! You cannot possibly have that kind of damage. You are completely off the deep end, thinking this way. Before you continue to try and plug every return vein, at least try to solve this by increasing blood flow. At least try a couple of weeks of light BTB jelqing.

>>I guess , with this in mind , I don't have too much choice , rather than taking the crazy risk of a cavernosographie. I wonder if its theoretically possible to inject a contrast agents through the artries , leading into the penis , rather than hooking the penis to a pump. All they need to see is where the blood leaves/leaks at 1000% erection.<

Yes, I believe they can inject contrast into the blood stream. Not positive though.

Without this kind of test, there is not even any way to see what the problem is. This test would also rule out a supply side problem. If there were no, or little leakage, at a high pressure, then you would know you do not have a vein leakage problem.

>>I guess thats the problem. I can't get a 1000% erection , naturally , with stimulation , injection , viagra..I guess this is why the hook peoples dicks to pumps, because they can PUMP SO MUCH into the dick (similar to what you were hintin at with the btb and the more inflow to fix my solution) so that the regular outflow is countered and the biggest hole (pressure finds its easy way) as in vENOUS LEAK is easily to identify.<<

Yep, that's it.

>i need to find a way of finding these leaks at minimal danger for the dick , and a way of shutting them for good !!!<

Just take it one step at a time, and take the LEAST invasive steps first. Do not be in a hurry. The least invasive step may be to increase the incoming blood first.

Bigger
 
Tbirdy if you can get hold of it, try spraying Glycerol Nitrate onto your penis and that should absorb into your penile bloodstream and make the vessells openmore and hence increase bloodflow.
Make sure you read it up before attempting it, see my thread on the main section.
Also BIB makes sense with what he's saying here so listen to the guy.
 
Bib,

I just read your post where you addressed my concerns about smooth muscle. My ideas were mostly speculative, gathered from a few (relatively intensive) weeks of research on erectile dysfunction. I don't really know much at all.

Thanks for your considerate response. I am going to a Urologist here in Pittsburgh tommorrow, July 13. I don't understand the extent of my ED. In fact, my ignorance is one of the worst parts about this ordeal for me.

By the way, how are you doing Provider? Is anything improving? How about you, Tbirdy?

Keep us informed.
 
@bib

But how confident are you in your blood supply, and why do you have this confidence? Did the Dr do any tests?

There shouldn't be a problem with the blood supply, remember , they performed a full duplex on me and found all 4 arteries to be working within normal ranges.

------------------------------------------------------------------
more info on venous leak :

source :http://my.weBathmated.com/content/article/4/1680_50142

---------------------------------------------------------
Venous leakage is a relatively common cause of erectile dysfunction. An inability to achieve and maintain the full erection occurs because blood leaks out in the presence of an adequate arterial inflow due to a damaged veno-corporo-occlusive mechanism. There are five theorized types of venogenic impotence.

Type 1 is due to the presence of an excessively large number of veins exiting the corporal body. This is probably congenital and is seen in young men with primary erectile dysfunction.

Type 2 is the weakening of the tough outer membrane of the corporal membrane of the corporal body known as the tunica albuginea, resulting in poor compression of the veins, such as in elderly men. I consider this a wear-and-tear phenomenon.

Type 3 is the loss of compliance of the cavernosal smooth muscle because of Peyronie's disease or scarring degeneration in patients with severe hardening of the arteries.

Type 4 is poor relaxation of the cavernous smooth muscle due to inadequate release of the hormones it takes to create an erection. This is typically common in heavy smokers.

Type 5 results from abnormal communications between the corpora cavernosa and the spongiosum due to trauma or a prior procedure to treat priapism. Patients with pure erectile dysfunction on the basis of a venous leak are rare, but many men have venous leakage as a component of their erectile dysfunction. Many years ago, we felt that this was a major problem, and during the early 1980s a great deal of venous leakage surgery was performed. We found that patients with specific venous leakage due to congenital abnormalities or specific trauma type situations do well with these types of operations, but the majority of patients do poorly. We still feel the first choice for patients who have venous leakage is a vacuum erection device or treatment with intercavernosal injections. The only patients who are candidates for a venous leakage operation are patients who have failed simple, noninvasive treatments.

Many people have attempted surgery for venous leakage. A host of different procedures attempt to make the diagnosis. All these techniques basically try to measure the pressures required to make blood leak out of the corporal bodies. Cavernosography is the technique of injecting dye into the corporal body to identify a leaking blood vessel. Prostaglandin is first injected to create an erection and then dye, which potentially identifies the site of the leakage. The results of these diagnostic procedures have not been dramatic.

When it has been determined that the patient is a good candidate for repair, the idea of treatment is to find the vein that is the source of the leakage and then tie it off. If the leaking vessel is near the base of the body, then an incision is made over that area. We feel that good candidates for venous surgery are those who have identified a localized leak and who have had a complete workup to rule out all the obvious causes for erectile dysfunction, including the Duplex Doppler examination. Surgical candidates should be nonsmokers, young, and have no other medical problems. A preoperative X-ray examination called the cavernosogram should identify the site of the leaking vessel.

The complications with this type of operation are numerous, as with all operations. They include numbness of the penis, scarring, a shortening or twisting of the penis, and painful erections.
---------------------------------------------------------------

So what I have to do next, so I was told by the other specialist is :

1. Get an MRi done to measure the desnity of the tunica albuginea and Bucks Fascie/Fascia Penis profunda. In order to check for injurys or cuts or leaks in those tissues.
-I will soon see a specialist who is specialized on ED and treating Induratio Penis Plastica. Incase I have a damaged tunica, with diffuse blood leakage, there is a op technique called "patching" (very invasive, but It could help me.

2. Get another VERY GOOD dfull duplex ultrasound scan with 40mg injection this time. In order to search for possible leak locations and display the arterial situation one more time.Get the results of the MRi and duplex (images and text) burned on cd for further investigation by the specialists in the other country.

this should cut through the fog some more...

I personally still have my hopes high for for the "one or 2 vein leaks from the cavernous body" situation. The first 2 week after the op strongly support a situation like that :)
If those veins wouldn't have rechanneld, I'd still be rock hard and 6" girth....
i thik those 2 weeks prooved, that the nerves, veins, smooth/spongy tissues and arterial supply is good enough , the only variable changed were the veins, at the base....

man how i wish all of this was over !!!
 
Hey guys. I haven't really read much of these long posts on the thread but just to let you know its finally time for my urologist visit. It's on tuesday afternoon.
 
Provider, be careful. I saw a urologist, and he was pretty dimsissive. Nice guy, but he did a little manual examination of my penis, took some blood and urine to be checked at the lab, checked my ass for prostatitis, gave me 3 pills of Cialis, and told me about some medically approved cock rings. You probably won't be happy if that happens to you, but you may not be able to get anything more than that from anything but a specialist. I pressed my doc a little bit and he said he could refer me to a guy at the Cleveland Clinic. I'm in the process of trying to make that happen.
 
It went ok thanks. He just asked me some questions and took some blood tests so nothing really happened. He said he can't really do anything until he gets the results from the blood tests which will be a week or two so I'll just have to wait until then.
 
I had an ultrasound scan today for my erection problems. They injected my dick with god knows what then scanned it. They didn't find anything though and said it seems normal. Looks like I'm gonna be stuck with a small dick that doesn't get fully erect.

When I found Penis Enlargement I thought it was one of the best things thats ever happened and now it looks like it's one of the worst.
 
Well considering the tests haven't shown anything its highly unlikeley that your problem is physical. Causes of ED are many and varied while studies on the subject are relatively few. What I'm saying is we don't know whats wrong and neither do the doctors so my suggestion to you is start taking pills. I'm serious tbirdy had a post about some 3 month study done with viagra which looked pretty promising. I think thats def worth a shot. So go back in this thread read it and consider trying it, you've really got nothing to lose and tbirdy really knows what he's talking about despite what some may say.
Another option is to ask your doctor for a Yohimbine prescription (not to be mistaken with Yohimbe) and try that, usually they'll give you a 3 month regiment of pills. Many people have had success with this.
Also mentally just relax, stop trying to force it, in a way just kind of accept it dont pay too much attention to it, even when your masterbating just ignore your dick concentrate on enjoying yourself. Most of all stop viewing this as a problem, try to leave it out of your day to day thoughts. Yeah this is hard but in time you can train yourself to do this.
I do not suggest magna rx, enzyte or any of that other crap you see on tv and the internet.
For now thats all I can come up with just remember you have many options that you haven't exhausted so don't worry. My suggestion is start with the yohimbine (only because it's the less extreme option), forget about your problem as best you can, dont think about it and in time without you even thinking about him your dick just might pop up and say hi with the same enthusiasm he had before your problems began.
 
What you need are some pharmacy grade fish oil tablets, and some Viagra.

I have problems like you do from time to time and for me its 10% physical 90% mental. You see, if I pop a tab of Viagra before fucking a broad.. just the thought that I just popped the viagra gets me rock hard and im ready to go. Keep in mind that half an hour later the viagra finally kicks in. Why would this be unless it was mental?

And the fish oil tabs make ya horny as hell for some reason. There is something in em like DHT or I dunno a 3 letter word though.

But ya if I was you id grab some Viagra just to prove to urself its mental. Then maybe pop blue skittles and tell yourself it is Viagra and watch it have the same effects.
 
I don't have any mental problems. I have a gf and it gets hard loads when I'm with her and we have sex, it just doesn't get fully hard. I'm lucky she is on the pill because if I had to use condoms it would be a nightmare. I know the problem is definately physical. I am only 19, I don't want to be taking viagra or any shit like that. I shouldn't need it and I can't afford it
 
Provider try the ROP, my erections are LOADZ better from it and it does work.
I cant say for the test increases because its early days but it helps your erections ten fold, and I recommend the guy matts22 whos a member here to make them.
 
Hey Provider,

My dick is still messed up, too. I don't think you or I will get much better, unfortunately, but hopefully I'm wrong. However, I was reading an article that talked about ways to reverse fibrosis (scarring). Heres the article:



L-arginine and phosphodiesterase (PDE) inhibitors counteract fibrosis in the Peyronie's fibrotic plaque and related fibroblast cultures.

Valente EG, Vernet D, Ferrini MG, Qian A, Rajfer J, Gonzalez-Cadavid NF.

Division of Urology, Research and Education Institute, Harbor-UCLA Medical Center, Torrance, CA, USA.

Inducible nitric oxide synthase (iNOS) is expressed in both the fibrotic plaque of Peyronie's disease (PD) in the human, and in the PD-like plaque elicited by injection of TGFbeta1 into the penile tunica albuginea (TA) of the rat. Long-term inhibition of iNOS activity, presumably by blocking nitric oxide (NO)- and cGMP-mediated effects triggered by iNOS expression, exacerbates tissue fibrosis through an increase in: (a) collagen synthesis, (b) levels of reactive oxygen species (ROS), and (c) the differentiation of fibroblasts into myofibroblasts. We have now investigated whether: (a) phosphodiesterase (PDE) isoforms, that regulate the interplay of cGMP and cAMP pathways, are expressed in both the human and rat TA; and (b) L-arginine, that stimulates NOS activity and hence NO synthesis, and PDE inhibitors, that increase the levels of cGMP and/or cAMP, can inhibit collagen synthesis and induce fibroblast/myofibroblast apoptosis, thus acting as antifibrotic agents. We have found by immunohistochemistry, RT/PCR, and Western blot that PDE5A-3 and PDE4A, B, and D variants are indeed expressed in human and rat normal TA and PD plaque tissue, as well as in their respective fibroblast cultures. As expected, in the PD fibroblast cultures, pentoxifylline (non-specific cAMP-PDE inhibitor) increased cAMP levels without affecting cGMP levels, whereas sildenafil (PDE5A inhibitor) raised cGMP levels. Both agents and L-arginine reduced the expression of collagen I (but not collagen III) and the myofibroblast marker, alpha-smooth muscle actin, as determined by immunocytochemistry and quantitative image analysis. These effects were mimicked by incubation with 8-Br-cGMP, which in addition increased apoptosis, as measured by TUNEL. When L-arginine (2.25 g/kg/day), pentoxifylline (10 mg/kg/day), or sildenafil (10 mg/kg/day) was given individually in the drinking water for 45 days to rats with a PD-like plaque induced by TGF beta1, each treatment resulted in a 80-95% reduction in both plaque size and in the collagen/fibroblast ratio, as determined by Masson trichrome staining. Both sildenafil and pentoxiphylline stimulated fibroblast apoptosis within the TA. Our results support the hypothesis that the increase in NO and/or cGMP/cAMP levels by long-term administration of nitrergic agents or inhibitors of PDE, may be effective in reversing the fibrosis of PD, and more speculatively, other fibrotic conditions.

MeSH Terms:
• Animals
• Apoptosis/drug effects
• Apoptosis/physiology*
• Arginine/pharmacology*
• Blotting, Western
• Cyclic GMP/analogs & derivatives
• Cyclic GMP/pharmacology
• Enzyme Inhibitors/pharmacology
• Fibrosis/drug therapy
• Fibrosis/enzymology
• Fibrosis/pathology
• Humans
• Male
• Nitric Oxide/metabolism
• Nitric-Oxide Synthase/metabolism
• Penile Induration/drug therapy*
• Penile Induration/enzymology
• Penile Induration/pathology*
• Penis/drug effects
• Penis/enzymology
• Penis/pathology*
• Pentoxifylline/pharmacology
• Phosphodiesterase Inhibitors/pharmacology*
• Phosphoric Diester Hydrolases/genetics
• Phosphoric Diester Hydrolases/metabolism*
• Piperazines/pharmacology
• RNA, Messenger/chemistry
• RNA, Messenger/genetics
• Rats
• Rats, Inbred F344
• Research Support, Non-U.S. Gov't
• Research Support, U.S. Gov't, P.H.S.
• Reverse Transcriptase Polymerase Chain Reaction

Substances:
• Enzyme Inhibitors
• Phosphodiesterase Inhibitors
• Piperazines
• RNA, Messenger
• Nitric Oxide
• sildenafil
• 8-bromocyclic GMP
• Pentoxifylline
• Arginine
• Cyclic GMP
• Nitric-Oxide Synthase
• inducible nitric oxide synthase
• Phosphoric Diester Hydrolases

Grant Support:
• G12 RR 03026/RR/NCRR
• R01 DK 53069/DK/NIDDK

PMID: 14996430 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]



The article difficult to understand, but some things that popped out at me include the dosaging required to reverse PD fibrosis in this study. I'm not suggesting you or I have PD, but perhaps we have fibrosis in our corpus cavernosa that is impeding inflatability and limiting veinous occlusion. L-arginine isn't too expensive, so maybe you could try that.

To all other readers, I'd like to express how terribly painful losing good functionality in my penis is for me. Some days I feel like I'll never be a viable lover again, and sometimes I wish I didn't exist so I wouldn't have to suffer with this. However, I did it to myself, and so it is no ones fault but my own. Still...

Let us know how your MRI goes man. I have a feeling that the test won't show anything wrong, and you'll be told that nothing is wrong with your penis.
 
Hey,
I had the MRI scan done. It was the worst thing ever. I hated every second of it. They said they will pass on the results to my specialist and I should get the results back in a couple of weeks. I'm doubtful they will find anything with it though.

I've tried using L-arginine before and also ZMA and I am currently using penis pills and have been for the last month and a half. The penis pills contain L-arginine and ginko and tribulus and lots of other stuff. I didn't notice any difference from these products at all. Not even more frequent erections or increased horniness. Let me know how you get on with it though. I guess it works for some and not for others.

I am quite lucky because I have been in a long term relationship when I damaged it and I am still with her. Shes been on the pill which is good cause I doubt I would have much luck using a condom when I can't get good erections. I feel scared to leave her though because I doubt I would find someone as understanding straight off and because I couldnt use a condom. I really hope this gets sorted because I don't see how my life will be the same if it's not. I am only 19.
 
I got a letter from the doctor today saying the results of my MRI scan were fine and so are all the other test i've had so basically im fucked. Great.
 
Yeah dude. I had a strong feeling your results would return as normal. Whats good is the results probably indicate there aren't any obviously serious structural problems with your penis. Have you considered a doppler sonography or something to measure blood flow? I'm truly sorry to say this, because I'm in the same boat, but you're probably gonna have to live with it. You can keep trying other doctors though. Sometimes problems go undetected by professionals for a long time.
 
It might be good to get a doppler test done, but it is my hunch that will also show up normal. I had both an MRI and a doppler and they showed up as normal. And I think you said your penis is not visibly different. Mine totally is. You can see and feel the difference in my flaccid. It`s like a totally different dick. It has no bulk or elasticity in the flaccid state. It`s just a weak piece of rubber that feels like the tissue has totally been blown out of it. But it still looks normal in the tests, which is really messed up.

I think people on these forums have a hard time believing a lot of this stuff. Especially the fact that we didn`t necessarily overdo it compared to a lot of people. I know I was too erect for some of my jelqs each session, but I tried to avoid it and let my erection subside as I neared 100%. I wasn`t purposely doing erect jelqs, I just would get erect from the stimultion. I think that`s a common problem that many guys would say they`ve experienced. But somehow my unit got completely fucked up. The last time I tried, I could get almost a full erection with oral sex before penetration, but I only get half erections at night and spontaneously, and they are very weak and rubbery because my dick has somehow been deformed inside. The head is often cold, and I have discoloration. Yet the urologist can`t pinpoint any particular problem that could be addressed.

I keep wondering how this happened to me when I know there are thousands of other guys who do much more dangerous stuff, even though I am sure many people read my posts and think I must have been doing something totally out of whack much more dangerous than what they do.

This is totally fucking up my life. I had an awesome life before I got into Penis Enlargement, but now I feel like I am on the brink of suicide all day because I have a gorgeous girlfriend who I thought I might possibly marry. We could have had a wonderful life potentially. I know our relationship won`t last much longer and I don`t know how I am going to be able to get on with my life knowing that I may likely be effectively impotent for the rest of my life. Viagra doesn`t even really make a difference for me. This whole situation has devastated me, and I`m sure you guys can relate. I contacted a guy on another forum who said his gradaully got better by abstaining from sex and masturbation for a long period of time (and stopping Penis Enlargement of course). So you might want to consider that. Good luck to you.
 
Provider said:
I got a letter from the doctor today saying the results of my MRI scan were fine and so are all the other test i've had so basically im fucked. Great.
Click to expand...

Yo dude u might want to try upping ur routine working even harder try hanging make sure u do btb jelqing and jelqing and kegels and do an insane work out but it must only be length not girth.

Buy a [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/join-now.html]Power assist[/words] if u dont have one this will make ur erections harder.
 
I don't know how often you stretch your penis but I've noticed in myself that after a good 30-40 min. stretch routine I will get a good erection after I've taken a short nap.
 
hey orbital , that is a truly amazing article that you've posted.
Despite the fact that it works for mice only , so far....

Untill now fibrosis and scarring of the corpus cavernosum was totally irreversible, if such a fibrosis was pinpointed to be the cause of your erectile dysfunction, than your only remaining option would be a "penile implant".

That article sparks some hope to reverse it AND it also totally corelates with the studys i posted: Those where hundreds of guys were given viagra daily for 3 - 6 month and after that their erections (tumescence + bloodflow) considerably improoved - most importantly , Penis EnlargementRMANENTLY, they did not have to take viagra any longer to keep the effects after the test duration..


@jtmorgan10

""""This is totally fucking up my life. I had an awesome life before I got into Penis Enlargement, but now I feel like I am on the brink of suicide all day because I have a gorgeous girlfriend who I thought I might possibly marry. We could have had a wonderful life potentially. I know our relationship won`t last much longer and I don`t know how I am going to be able to get on with my life knowing that I may likely be effectively impotent for the rest of my life. Viagra doesn`t even really make a difference for me. This whole situation has devastated me, and I`m sure you guys can relate."""""


---> Man, listen. I totally feel what you are saying there, I've been there, with exactly the same mindset, thoughts, also in a long term relationship, I can totally relate to everyting you say. Now since, alot of time passed since then let me tell you one thing...eventhough it may SEEM to you as the END of the WORLD and your life for you - ITS NOT..its just a phase and you will eventually get through it, the sooner, the better...infact I really stress the word SEEMS...it only appears to be so bad because you think about this and only this ED problem of yours ALL the day AND whats even worse you are relating your relationship problems and most probably EVERY problem that you have or MIGHT get in the future to ED. (You worry about things you cannot control like the past or the future)

Do not dwell on it. I understand its hard for you because you are probably young and your mind hasn't matured enough to cope with stress like that. Thats why this this problem takes up all your universe...

..lemme give you some simple advice to get you started feeling good again AND get you on the right track to recover.

1. Accept the fact that you have ED. Stop thinking about it as your BIGGEST and only problem and the missing puzzle to a succesfull life. Only YOU can effectively hinder yourself from achieving those "goals/ dreams" in life that you mentioned <<<"We could have had a wonderful life potentially. I know our relationship won`t last much longer and I don`t know how I am going to be able to get on with my life knowing">>> Notice how you keep mentioning yourself and her or both of you ? Thats because IT IS UP TO YOU AND HER to make it last. Your dick is probably the least important factor in a possible future marriage or the current relationship. You just allow it to get to you, and once it gets you down it reflects on everything else...but only because YOU let it happen !!! Every second marriage gets cancelled after 1 year of marriage. Do you think its because all those guys had ED ? Hell no , its due to cummunication problems/inabilitys/weak charakters/lack of personality/commitment/ WORK !!!!!! and so on.


2. GAIN KNOWLEDGE. Know your enemy ! Pinpoint the reason behind your ED. Don't obsess, inform yourself !
You are obviously lacking alot of knowledge when it comes to ED, you need to do much better research - I promise, the more you know, the less you will have to worry about things (you didn't know before and still feared them).
Hint: The knowledge and all possible reasons and also all up-to-date cures were already researched by me and others on this forum , you can find the information in my posts (clicking on profile and clicking on "view all posts or threads by tbirdy).
If you did so you wouldn't say things like :
" I may likely be effectively impotent for the rest of my life." Well did you know that you could get an instant cure by a modern undetectable penle implant that totally simulates a real erection and your orgasms and sensivity remains the same , so ? What do you fear.
That above is highly unlikely and definetly not neccessary for you right now, but its still a possible fix to a possible condition in the future wich you wouldn't worry about if you knew about the cure.

another example ?

"Viagra doesn`t even really make a difference for me."

Well DID you even try that 3 - 6 month daily 50 mg before sleep routine as mentioned in the study done in 2005 that effectivly cured many many men with medium erectile dysfunction ( exactly what you have) ???

Besides, I have a feeling that you are either unconciously shitting yourself or me :
You say viagra doesn't really make a difference AND that your dick is oh so fucked up but then last time you tried :

"The last time I tried, I could get almost a full erection with oral sex before penetration, but I only get half erections at night and spontaneously, and they are very weak and rubbery because my dick has somehow been deformed inside. The head is often cold, and I have discoloration."

You fucking got it up had sex , had nighttime and spontanious erections...WTF ? Seems like light to medium ED to me and that eventhough it doesn't work 100% like it used to , it still works !!!!

So how can you be devasted ? Pls totally shut the fuck up bout even mentioning suicide ??? What the hell ??? What for ?

You do know that viagra at any dosing STILL needs a sexual stimuls ( you need to feel the urge and get turned on) in order to work ??? So do yourself a favour : Don't touch your dick for a week (as in no mastuarbation ejaculation) then plan a romantic day with your girl , nice dinner and shit , take 100 mg viagra 2 hours before (the 2 of you prbably get down) get a blowjob from here , and THEN come back telling me viagra didn't make a difference...

Well ok now , I don't want to be to harsh, just trying to get your head straight again...you should have nuff inout and ideas to get you started in the right directions...




BACK TO THE ARTICLE :

"When L-arginine (2.25 g/kg/day), pentoxifylline (10 mg/kg/day), or sildenafil (10 mg/kg/day) was given individually in the drinking water for 45 days to rats with a PD-like plaque induced by TGF beta1, each treatment resulted in a 80-95% reduction in both plaque size and in the collagen/fibroblast ratio, as determined by Masson trichrome staining. Both sildenafil and pentoxiphylline stimulated fibroblast apoptosis within the TA. Our results support the hypothesis that the increase in NO and/or cGMP/cAMP levels by long-term administration of nitrergic agents or inhibitors of PDE, may be effective in reversing the fibrosis of PD, and more speculatively, other fibrotic conditions."


Jeeez,
L-arginine (2.25 g/kg/day), pentoxifylline (10 mg/kg/day), or sildenafil (10 mg/kg/day) was given individually in the drinking water for 45

In humans =
I would need 191,25 g Argnine , 850 mg of pentoxifylline,
and or 850 mg Viagra....

Ok obviously it doesn't translated from mice to humans without killing the human with the above combo...
so I think what would do the trick is taking the highest allowed/confirmed non poison dosing of each drug daily.

Viagra = Confirmed 100 max , but probably 150 spread throughout the day will be possible.

l-arginine 6-15 grams per day.

and only the pentoxifylline is no problem because an adult can take up to 1200 mg in 3 dosings spread though the day...


Well since all of these drugs do fuck with your blood pressure and heart beat (lowering one and upping the other) its probably safest to try this routine with 10 g arginine and 1200 mg pentoxifylline daily and see what it does for you after a month or 2...

This totally looks like the next step in the right direction:
The studys I mentioned used only viagra for 3-6 month and got great results,
its also proven that l-arginine helps with erections if taken in dosing above 3 grams for a long enough time..so both of them combined would probably have a synergetic great effect. This wasn't tried yet and I can#t tell if its safe to try in the future because each of these drugs do lower your blood pressure significantly and if combined , you could drop dead...

so take care if your willing to try...i wouldn't do this without daily control by a trustworthy doctor that monitors all your body functions especially your heart....
besides , who says you couldn't get the same "mice" effect on humans with 50 mg viagra and 3 grams l-arginine daily...hasn*t been tried yet...

ok, last but not least

IXL and PANDORA

I guess you are trying to help the guys in this thread but what you are doing is equally to: Telling an alcolholic who got in all of his problems BECAUSE OF THE ALCOHOLE , to drink even more , and , better , and harder liquier to solve his problems...

that will not do it :)


~ peace tbirdy
 
ba-ba-ba BUMP !!!!!!!

Combine my last post in this thread with

10INCHADVANTAGE's thread on CHEMICAL [words=http://www.phallosan.com/shop/catalog/default.php?z=eNortjIxtVKyL0pNszWxMFcrSSxKTy2JL0hMT7U1UisoykyxtbBQSy4tLsnPjS8uKcrMS7dVsgZcMMpbEbo%2C]ADS[/words]

http://www.mattersofsize.com/forum/showthread.php?t=30863


and all you people suffering from any type of ED or damage have something
worth trying out !

Basically, u either use 50mg V before sleep daily for 6 month

or do the same with cialis 10-15 mg every 4 days for 6 month

in an attempt to reverse fibrosis and clean up your arteries, improove your blood flow.

And last but not least, take bib's "jelquing behind the balls to free up possible plaque" advice in consideration. (Though its risky I think, plaque in system = possible heart/lung/brain arterie obstructions)

The First advice by me is backed up by studys , it worked for many men, so try it out. The second is probably a even better way with less side effects...

and the last one has to be discussed to the fullest yet.


p.s. What happened to the guys and their problems in this thread ???
 
Provider;154527 said:
Hey guys,
I have been having some real erection problems and it's really starting to piss me off. I haven't been able to get erect properly for about 2 months now. The most it gets is like 75% erect on its own. I started to so some more girth work and then my erections got weaker. This is the routine I was doing:
- Hot wrap
- 5 mins of manual stretching
- 10 mins of wet jelqing
- 10 x 40second ULIs
- Hot wrap

Before that I was just doing a jelqing routine or something. I really wanted some more girth so I started doing the routine above for a while and it was going fine until my erections started getting weaker. The routine isn't even intense, especially compared to some other guys, and I'd been Penis Enlargementing for quite a while so didn't see a problem doing this routine. I did it most days. When I started getting the erection problems I kept up the Penis Enlargement but not as much. Then when they didn't get back I stopped Penis Enlargement. I've stopped Penis Enlargement for a month now, apart from the odd wet jelqing session, and they still haven't come back properly! It's really annoying me now.

I know it can't be a mental thing because this has happened to me before when I started to do more girth work. I stopped Penis Enlargement and the erections came back after about 3-4 weeks. But that hasn't happened this time.

I also don't think it can be mental because it does get like 70% erect or whatever but just not full. It feels like theres just not enough blood going into it. I get girls and it still doesn't get fully hard. If I am masturbating or doing something with a girl it may get 85% erect max but if you leave it alone it will go back down to 50% or whatever after 20 seconds or something!!

I do my kegels and I do the odd wet jelqing session to try and promote blood flow. I even took ZMA for about a month to try and boost my testostrone and erections etc but it still didn't help. I've got down masturbation a lot too.

Theres no noticable difference in my cock just by looking at it so I don't know what it is. I can only think my cock is damaged some how and not enough blood is getting into it or something like that.

Please guys, don't advise me to take viagra or anything like that because I am 19 and shouldn't need that shit and I also can't afford it!

I am only 19 and I can do without this shit in my life. My girl is getting bored with it. My cocks small enough as it is and I can do without not being able to get fully erect so it's even smaller!

If you guys can help at all it would be much appreciated. I will asnwer all questions you have etc. Please help.

Cheers
Click to expand...

I still think the best solution for injury prevention is to do 5-15 minutes of hot wraps in between EACH exercise. Yeah, it will take longer, but it will slow your workout and prevent rushing.
 
I'm taking 50mg viagra prior to sleep, and I also bought the TENS (electrostimulation) machine that Tbirdy suggested. I can repost my experience after a few months.
 
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