The Mandingo Complex

Z03, the point is that this isn't happening anymore. The only way to get past all the crap that happened before is to do just that: get past it. Do what you can to make life better for you and your family, because yes, blacks did get put behind by all the racism. But don't expect special rights and protections. The Irish didn't get it, the Jews didn't get it, immigrants from poor third world countries don't get it. Blacks shouldn't be any different. They should have just as many rights and protections as anyone else. No more, no less. You don't deserve anything extra because of what my ancestors did to your ancestors. It's history now.

And just because lonerj isn't black doesn't mean his argument doesn't hold weight. Racism is racism. It's wrong no matter who it is directed at. You saying that it isn't as bad since it is directed at a white/korean person is a very racist statement in itself.

I wonder, do you also think Jews should be given more rights? If we follow your logic, Jews should have WAY more rights, etc. than any other race. They have been persecuted for thousands of years. Much longer than blacks. Don't give me this crap about you DESERVE more than other people. You are a HUMAN. That's what it boils down to. We all deserve no more and no less than anyone else. Just because you're black doesn't mean you are better. We are all human. Get over this race crap because in the end race is nothing.

John
 
z03 said:
That argument really doesnt hold weight. No kind or form of racism that any other race has experienced comes even close to comparing to what blacks in america went through during and after slavery. Not only was this racism violent and hateful, but it was supported by the national government until around the 1960's. Slavery itself went on for 100s of years in the world. Some many horrible things happened as a result of slavery, thousands and thousands of blacks were routinely mutilated, raped, lynched, and treated as second class human beings for years and years and years. Now how hard do you think it is for black people to respect white people after all of that!? Blacks have been put severely behind economically and socially because of racism. This is what leads to us living in slums, doing drugs, eating fast food, and dealing with our frustration in a wrong and violent way with reverse racism and superior attitudes. Yeah, I didnt experience the lynchings and what not myself, but Im forced to deal with the aftermath and that is why we get and DESERVE the things that the government gives us. So before you start whining about how blacks think they are "cooler" than everybody consider all we have gone through to get to where we are today, and if we misuse or abuse what weve earned than that is wrong and im sorry, but before you hold us up as such horrible people, think about who you are what white America did even after slavery had ended and how that is the real root of the problem.
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I agree white oppression, caused black retaliation, no doubt about it. Years and years of mistreatment, even after slavery, even to this day. A black family finds it much harder to get a home with a decent loan, its proven whites automatcially get a better price, and intrest rate, even if the two subjects have an identical credit rating. Same goes with car prices and loans, same goes with insurance. In genral police give black men and women a harder time when being pulled over. Some of those that work as police are racist. Black men will recieve a longer jail sentence than a white man will for the same exact type of crime. Why corprate racism at work. A lot more racism goes on than the normal person believes.
 
crazyed27 said:
I agree with music invented in america as american music. Though what went on was the music industry completely disrespecting the black artist. It still going on today. Causing ill feelings with many black music lovers and musicans. The state of hip hop today, look at it, bling bling, hoes, hydro, and bank rolls. Escalades sittin on dubs, gucci, sex, guns. ect...The music industry has control of what goes out to the main stream. You will rarley find deep thought provoking hip hop on the mainstream. This hip hop does exist in the undergroud. The record companys contruibute to the negative image of the black man and woman, they find a young person with talent, throw money in there face and pretty much tell them this is your image if you don't want to do it you won't get paid, and here by the way sign on the dotted line...its been going on for years and years.
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Do you know why the music industry pushes this image with black people? It isn't because white people are trying to take over the world. It's because the audience that primarily listens to this music wants to hear all this stuff you talk about. The music industry is not in it to make people think. They are in it for money. So they promote what the American public wants to hear. Do you think they would promote the "gangsta" image if nobody wanted to hear it and nobody bought it? NO. They do it because that is what is popular. So the artists that really have something to say steer clear and only show up in "the underground" and on indie labels. Why? Because they know that they won't sell millions of records anyway, because the mojority of America doesn't want to hear it. I'm not saying this is good. I wish that some really GOOD music would be promoted. But whoever said this said it best: "Nobody ever went broke by underestimating the taste of the American public." You don't see thought-provoking rappers because most of America doesn't have good enough taste to listen to it. It isn't white peoples' faults. It isn't the fault of "white corporate America." It's simply a result of our times. People don't want to have to think. They just want to enjoy themselves.

John
 
One thing we all need to remember: I don't think there are any more racist white people than there are black people. Yes, a black man is likely to get treated worse by white people than a white man. But the opposite is also true. A white person is likely to get treated worse by black people than a black man would. The thing is, IT IS WRONG, no matter who is treating whom badly.

Arguing about which race is treated worse is like arguing which band is better. It's pointless. What we need to do is not focus on how badly a certain group is treated, but instead focus on treating EVERYBODY with more respect and love than we do right now. Don't look at someone's color. We are all just people. MJ said it best. It don't matter if you're black or white. We need to all just learn to treat everybody better.

John
 
I'm through,I love all people! But I hate fake ass people! Good points everybody! Everybody deserves much respect. This could have easily turned into a heated name calling session, but everybody kept it mature!!!! Peace!
 
9cyclops9 gets 1000 points for his posts.... you are right on EVERY aspect you have mentioned.....
9cyclops9 said:
MJ said it best. It don't matter if you're black or white. We need to all just learn to treat everybody better.
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Yeah, he said that, because he WAS black and is white NOW.... well he looked WAAAAAAAAY much better as a black!!!

C YA!
 
z03 said:
This is what leads to us living in slums.
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You didn't live in the slums....

z03 said:
For me, growing up in the suburbs
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You are making all these statements about how you have been held down socioeconomically, yet you grew up in the suburbs. Doesn't sound like too bad of a life you have there. Doesn't sound like you were held back

I called you on several racist statements you yourself have made, but no response was made by you. Why is that? Reverse racism is no better.


Many people have come to this country with nothing much later than segregation ended and they have been able to make a life for themselves. No to mention the countless number of blacks who have succeeded in all walks of life and are looked up to by people of all color.

Nobody doubts what happened to the black people was terrible, but how long is this going to be an excuse for why black people are being held back? Is there a time frame on it? How long does it take?
 
z03 said:
That argument really doesnt hold weight. No kind or form of racism that any other race has experienced comes even close to comparing to what blacks in america went through during and after slavery. Not only was this racism violent and hateful, but it was supported by the national government until around the 1960's. Slavery itself went on for 100s of years in the world. Some many horrible things happened as a result of slavery, thousands and thousands of blacks were routinely mutilated, raped, lynched, and treated as second class human beings for years and years and years. Now how hard do you think it is for black people to respect white people after all of that!? Blacks have been put severely behind economically and socially because of racism. This is what leads to us living in slums, doing drugs, eating fast food, and dealing with our frustration in a wrong and violent way with reverse racism and superior attitudes. Yeah, I didnt experience the lynchings and what not myself, but Im forced to deal with the aftermath and that is why we get and DESERVE the things that the government gives us. So before you start whining about how blacks think they are "cooler" than everybody consider all we have gone through to get to where we are today, and if we misuse or abuse what weve earned than that is wrong and im sorry, but before you hold us up as such horrible people, think about who you are what white America did even after slavery had ended and how that is the real root of the problem.
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I get real sick and tired of hearing black men and women complain about what "they had to go through" like 100 years ago or earlier. It is really not important now. Why live for the past Z03 and worry about what happened then. It doesnt really matter now does it. There are so many other things to enjoy in life rather than wine about how your ancestors were slaves once. This is the problem that 90% of black people have is this attitude that we as white people owe them something. White people dont owe black people shit. Its not our fault what happened 100 years ago and neither is it the black person's fault either. I have many good black friends and get along with them just great. Everyone is different my friend. Its more than just white versus black. There is more of a genetic variation in the white race between actual individuals claiming to be white than the black race also. And another thing i would like to point out is that the black people were treated bad as slaves at some point but your own kings in Africa sold you so you cant blame it on whites. The Jews were treated and persecuted way more than the black race EVER HAS!!!!!!
 
Just some "Final Thoughts":

As I said the Rx is "individualism and personal responsibility." Most people wont embrace these concepts because it is too easy not to.

As an individualist, I dont believe in collective guilt or collective achievement. I don't believe in "collective" anything. It is anti-conceptual. I dont treat people as lumps of genetic material nor as herds or tribes.

As long as collectivism lives, so will racism. It takes many forms and no matter the name, they are all the same. And collectivism cannot be fought with another form of collectivism. Nationalism or fascism cannot be fought with socialism and vice versa. I think racism will always exist because collectivism will never die, but hopefully it will exist on a small level, in the hearts of only a few cowards.
 
First of all stop generalizing. I do not think all blacks complain about being held down by 100 or 1000 f--king years of slavery stop generalizing. We "blacks" do not all feel the same way.

Ok, I get f--king tired of hearing about blacks complaining myself because it is a reflecting on me. So chill out. This issue is never going to change.

People are going to have there opinions, racism will exist. It is not about black and white. The problem is bigger then the same shit.

Black people have problems. Hell everyone has issues. What are you going to do about it. Hell racism exists with black people. It is not about white people being racist anymore. Black people have the problem now. So I suggest to those black gentlemen enough is enough stop bringing up 100 to 1000 years of slavery. If I was white then I to would get tired of hearing about blacks complaining about being slaves all the "damn" time as well.

This shit will never change. It will be here until we are all old and gray.

So we need to call it a day.
 
9cyclops9 said:
Do you know why the music industry pushes this image with black people? It isn't because white people are trying to take over the world. It's because the audience that primarily listens to this music wants to hear all this stuff you talk about. The music industry is not in it to make people think. They are in it for money. So they promote what the American public wants to hear. Do you think they would promote the "gangsta" image if nobody wanted to hear it and nobody bought it? NO. They do it because that is what is popular. So the artists that really have something to say steer clear and only show up in "the underground" and on indie labels. Why? Because they know that they won't sell millions of records anyway, because the mojority of America doesn't want to hear it. I'm not saying this is good. I wish that some really GOOD music would be promoted. But whoever said this said it best: "Nobody ever went broke by underestimating the taste of the American public." You don't see thought-provoking rappers because most of America doesn't have good enough taste to listen to it. It isn't white peoples' faults. It isn't the fault of "white corporate America." It's simply a result of our times. People don't want to have to think. They just want to enjoy themselves.

John
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WRONG. Cash Money, Bad Boy, Rockafella, Deathrow, Def Jam are all run by whites and the majority of the successful black artists are from there. White coporate american wasn't involved with it. The blacks marketed themselves that way.
 
I agree that it's much too easy to cry racism, to get what you want in the world today.

As an example, there was a black guy that was trying to sue a school in my city for too high tuition. His reason? He claimed that the school's high tuition is an act of racism because black people don't very much money and they were charging alot to keep him out.

That is so ridiculous I can't even begin to pick apart how stupid and selfish it is.
 
z03 said:
That argument really doesnt hold weight. No kind or form of racism that any other race has experienced comes even close to comparing to what blacks in america went through during and after slavery. Not only was this racism violent and hateful, but it was supported by the national government until around the 1960's. Slavery itself went on for 100s of years in the world. Some many horrible things happened as a result of slavery, thousands and thousands of blacks were routinely mutilated, raped, lynched, and treated as second class human beings for years and years and years.
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Oh no? So I guess you guys were better off than the Jewish... The whole "black people don't get enough" attitude obviously is created with black leaders because they have obviously felt it. The fact that it rubs off on the rest of blacks is nonsense.

You haven't even felt it first hand and you say my argument doesn't hold weight? So a bunch of blacks coming in and ridiculing another race every day doesn't hold weight? Are you out of your damn mind?


z03 said:
Blacks have been put severely behind economically and socially because of racism. This is what leads to us living in slums, doing drugs, eating fast food, and dealing with our frustration in a wrong and violent way with reverse racism and superior attitudes.
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That is the worst excuse you can come up with. Black people strongly encourage the superior attitude towards others from my experience -- and it's not derived from "I was oppressed, I need to fight back" attitude, it's derived from the whole black machismo attitude that breeds ignorance.

Even then, why is it right for blacks to put the reverse racism on other races besides whites?
 
lonerj said:
WRONG. Cash Money, Bad Boy, Rockafella, Deathrow, Def Jam are all run by whites and the majority of the successful black artists are from there. White coporate american wasn't involved with it. The blacks marketed themselves that way.
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What a dumbass I am, I meant that these labels were run by blacks. They marketed it, created the music and did everything...
 
Ok, that's fine. I said that in response to whomever was saying that white corporate America pushes black artists to the public as being "gangstas" and stuff. I was saying that if whites push that it's because the audience wants it. It doesn't matter who markets rap as being for "gangstas," my point was that it isn't the fault of white people. Its just what people want to hear.

John
 
I don't know the ages of everyone here, but for me, I have never witnessed this so called hatred towards blacks. Generation X and Y were never a part of it. We were not around when segregation was the norm. So I don't know if people who are having completely different views are people from different generations or not.

But what I do know is that I border between generation X and Y. What I personally have experienced in my life is reverse racism. I was brought up when affirmative action became law and knew that when I went to look for a job, I may be equally or more so qualified but still not get the job. While applying to colleges, I received an application from the University of Michigan, and was disgusted when I saw separate categories for the SAT/ACT scores you needed to get in depending on what race you were. I needed at least a 10% higher score than someone who was black.

Then the decision from the supreme court came about with Michigan about a year ago about how they have been reversely racist in accepting people into their law school and were given a specific amount of time to change their standards. This finally was a step in the right direction in my opinion.

Here's my thing. People of all races, genders, whatever complain about wanting equality. I have less of a chance to get a job than a person of a different race or a woman. It seems to me that being a white man I am now the odd man out. I'm not trying to complain or look for sympathy, but z03, you say white men don't know what it's like to be a black man, but black men don't know what it's like to be a white man either. And what have I actually done to deserve being treated differently?
 
Xulf said:
I don't know the ages of everyone here, but for me, I have never witnessed this so called hatred towards blacks.
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I am 24 and I have witnessed shit. I am glad you never have or have never been a part of it. As far as the rest, I agree with what you are saying.
 
I agree with some of your thoughts; however this statement:

It seems to me that being a white man I am now the odd man out. I'm not trying to complain or look for sympathy

That is a BIG stretch don't you think. I actually attended UofM by the way. I'm 25 and have seen all types of racism. It exists BIG time man, don't be mislead. I'm very successful and I don't let it affect me but I encounter it alot. This isn't institutional racism but let me give you an example of some situations that were kind of ackward...I used to study on the top floor of the library...meaning that you could only go down on the elevator. I'm not an intimidating looking guy, but I had several situations at UofM where white woman would not even get on the elevator with me. That would just wait for the next one. This is minor, but with employment, etc man racism is still very prevalent..its just more discrete. Remember, African Americans just received voting rights just 40 years ago! We still had jim crow laws!

I actually one of the guys who is against affirmative action to a certain extent because I think it is the wrong approach. It is like trying to cure a dying tree by attaching the leaves...you need to worry about the roots.

But to say that the white man is the odd man out is the most ridiculous shit in the world. I mean who are you kidding man. I remember that Chris Rock joke..even a one armed unemployed white man wouldn't want to be my black ass and I'm rich.

I have alot of white friends and this funny conversation came up about racial profiling. He had never been pulled over before in his life until this year. He is 24 and he has been pulled over three times in the last several months...and guess when...I was in the passenger seat all three times. So the problems exist.
 
I agree that it's much too easy to cry racism, to get what you want in the world today.>>>

In response to this statement: I get annoyed by this myself. I hate when people pull the racism card when it isn't the case. This type of behavior allows for serious cases of racism to be ignored.
 
I got your The Mandingo Complex right here in my pants its called "A little reverse action" BLHAHJAHAHAHHAHA
 
goingdeeper said:
I agree that it's much too easy to cry racism, to get what you want in the world today.>>>

In response to this statement: I get annoyed by this myself. I hate when people pull the racism card when it isn't the case. This type of behavior allows for serious cases of racism to be ignored.
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I was thinking this earlier myself. When people are so quick to pull the racism card, its hard to distinguish when there is a real problem ( kindof a Boy WHo Cried Wolf type thing). Also it really disgusts me when people do this because it makes a mockery out of and is disrespectful to people who had really horrible things and unspeakably racist things happen to them.
 
I suppose I would like to comment, just to weigh in. I didn't have time to ready every post carefully, my apologies if I am terribly redundent.

I would be a fool to suggest I have the proper few, or comprehensive understanding of all racial issues, particularly those between black and white people in the US. But I would say that comment applies to most anybody. Here is what I am realatively certain of.

Racism certainly still exists, and the racism of the past has molded the black communites and condition of today. The racism towards African-Americans was particularly brutal and irrational, and existed in our very recent history.

Many white people feel a certain sense of outrage that black people complain about the effects of racism because they feel it is either unjustified, of that there is a double standard in regard to addressing racial issues with black people.

It is my belief this outrage is unfounded. However, unjustified as it may be, it also perfectly acceptable to hold any opinon one pleases. What is not acceptable is attempting to somehow rationalize your dislike or opinions about any certain racial group, which is something of a social construct at this point anyways, rather than just say that you don't particularly care for them.

Many posters initially complained about being upset by the "superior" or arrogant attitude they felt they had observed in black people. They used these experiences to make broadly sweeping judgements about black people in general, using personal experiences and impressions to characterize a diverse and varied group of individuals. While not overtly racist, attitdues like this are the seeds of racial discrimination. Black people suffer racial indignities on a much wider scale than white people who are offended by their inability to complain about black people holding, or displaying equally racist opinions. Few (or any that I am aware of) white people have been beaten to death by black police officers who have previously displayed racist tendancies. There are no black hate groups that distribute propaganda calling for race war and extermination. They are very few black CEOs, far fewer black millionares (and I am referring to per capita), and a ghastly amount of young black men will be imprisoned at some point in their lives. The playing field is not equal. While some may feel that black people have at times displayed some hypocrtitical or otherwise unfair practices in regards to race relations, this is hardly a justification of writing off the amount of abuse, former and current, that blacks have suffered and will likely continue to for some time.

Seeing a race display an attitude or behavior that one feels they would recieve more sever penalties for reciprocating is no reason to suggest that the amount of racism towards black people is insignificant. If certain black people do not like white people, or as some have suggested, regard tham as inferior, then that is in fact their right. But understand that what you are observing is more of a culture clash than racial. White America has never been victimized by black people, that is statement does not hold true when reversed.

The resentment towards African Americans runs strong and deep, almost latently, in many individuals, many who would not even consider themselves racist. We all hold certain prejudices, assumptions. I for one, am excited to see black culture step to the forefront of entertainment, athletics, and hopefully other fields of public perspective. While the hegemony of any race over any field is probably neither good nor bad so long as it is not artificially instituted, I believe that the true face of America is a cultural and racial melting pot. One would be hard pressed to deny that the typical WASP class (of which I am a member) has long dominated the face of the country. I for one hope for a future, idealized as it may be and often has been, when our various cultural standards have merged to an even greater degree. This is not to forget history, write off the past, or supress the vibrancy of any unique culture and group, but rather to embrace the future and human brotherhood.
 
So far as the original topic of the thread, the mandingo complex, that I could not comment on. I could not say whether black men on average have bigger penises or not, nor do I care at all. I do not understand why so many people lobby so hard against the notion. It may not hold any water, but as numerous other psoters have commented, some physical differences are assumed among the races. What is damaging to anybody to suggest that black men have bigger penises on average, except to perhaps the subjects of the article who may suffer from insecurity due to high expectations?

I have read other threads where people argue at length and passionately that it simply cannot be true. Where does this come from? Penis size does not relate to IQ, behavior, or any number of perhaps more trenchant subjects that people tend to point out as matters of racial difference. Why especially, would white people be so concerned with an assumption that primarily affects black men?
 
lonerj said:
What a dumbass I am, I meant that these labels were run by blacks. They marketed it, created the music and did everything...
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Def Jam is not run by blacks the top dogs calling the shots are white, All of those other record labels you mentioned are just small branches of large record distributers. Rockafella is part of def jam, cash money is part of colombia records, bad boy is a branch of def jam, Its misleading.
 
goingdeeper said:
I agree with some of your thoughts; however this statement:

It seems to me that being a white man I am now the odd man out. I'm not trying to complain or look for sympathy

That is a BIG stretch don't you think. I actually attended UofM by the way. I'm 25 and have seen all types of racism. It exists BIG time man, don't be mislead. I'm very successful and I don't let it affect me but I encounter it alot.
........

But to say that the white man is the odd man out is the most ridiculous shit in the world. I mean who are you kidding man. I remember that Chris Rock joke..even a one armed unemployed white man wouldn't want to be my black ass and I'm rich.
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When I say I feel like the odd man out, I mean in the business world, I am basing this on afirmative action, and gender quotas that many companies use now. I have several friends who were denied scholarships or jobs or promotions b/c they were a white man. Basically they were the 'norm' and even though they had exceptional records they were left out in the cold for someone of a different culture or a woman who didn't have as good of grades or experience etc.

Don't get me wrong at all I do realize that racism still exists towards black people and I have seen it first hand. When I said I never saw the hatred towards them, I was referring to segregation and slavery (as I reread I didn't put it properly, but was the point of the whole age thing). Racism is a terrible, hurtful thing said by ignorant people. But I think it should go both ways.
 
crazyed27 said:
Def Jam is not run by blacks the top dogs calling the shots are white, All of those other record labels you mentioned are just small branches of large record distributers. Rockafella is part of def jam, cash money is part of colombia records, bad boy is a branch of def jam, Its misleading.
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LOL. Def Jam is a branch of a major label run by black people. Do you REALLY think that the white folks affect the way black artist are marketed?

Take P.Diddy and Cash Money for example (bad artists anyway) but they are at the top and so was the other major labels like rockafella and def jam and the black people were running the show.
 
lonerj said:
LOL. Def Jam is a branch of a major label run by black people. Do you REALLY think that the white folks affect the way black artist are marketed?
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Actually Def Jam was mostly run by a white , Jewish (I think Israeli) man named Lyor Cohen, and it was started by a white guy named Rick Rubin. Many of its interns as well as executives have been white. Rick Rubin started it and at the time Russell Simmons and Lyor Cohen were business partners in an artist management company, Rush. They all combined forces in the mid 80s and secured major label distribution. Rubin left to form his own American Recordings (Def American) in the late 80s and Russ Simmons became the head of Def Jam with Lyor Cohen president. Eventually Russell decided to focus more on Phat Farm and community service projects, leaving Lyor Cohen in charge. It was that way probably the past 10 years or so. Jay Z, Rocafella, Murder Inc, and all those people, all those Joint Venture deals were made by Lyor Cohen. Lyor recently left and supposedly at his going away party, Jay Z said he was the best friend he's ever had in the music business.
 
lonerj said:
LOL. Def Jam is a branch of a major label run by black people. Do you REALLY think that the white folks affect the way black artist are marketed?

Take P.Diddy and Cash Money for example (bad artists anyway) but they are at the top and so was the other major labels like rockafella and def jam and the black people were running the show.
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Here's the link read it yourself!

http://www.soundgenerator.com/news/index.cfm?articleid=3091

Do you still have doubts?
 
WHO CARES?

Seriously, why does it matter? Apparently the artists don't have a problem with it or they wouldn't do business with the companies. I really don't see why we're still arguing about this. I'm done with it.

John
 
Okay guys, look, this is the last post Im gonna make about this, because all the respones you guys make ive already answered. If you would take the time to really read what I write and think about it, Ive already addressed your responses.

1. I never said whites and asians could not be naturally smarter. I said it was just as possible as blacks being athletic and large penises due to regional conditioning or it was natural. I only said it was harder to measure b/c a lot of intelligence needs to be developed and is based on education (unless you are thomas edison or something like that) which costs money and is due to where you live, but if you are fast or can jump high with a high motabilism, its just naturally there in any setting.

2. Yeah I live in the suburbs, but I was not only talking about myself, I was speaking in terms of blacks as a whole. And the effects have slavery have still not been overcome. I am of a very lucky minority of current black 20 and 30 somethings where both parents were able to go to college. Its no coincidence that intercities and poorer areas are filled with blacks. The reason other minorities other than native-americans are commonly poor is because they are immigrants and have to start over, not because they were enslaved and then persecuted for 100s of years as opposed to maybe 20 or 30 with the irish, italians, and others in America, which in no way was anywhere near as bad as what blacks faced. This is why we get help from the government to accelerate the process to where it is a level playing field in terms of oppurtunities and education.

3. Speaking of Jews and other immigrants, most blacks arent immigrants!! The only reason were here is mostly b/c of slavery!! And anything that anyother demonination has faced in AMERICA, blacks have faced the most and harsh oppression for the longest period of time. There were laws set up to segregrate and hold us down until the 1960's for goodness sake!!!

Seriously, you guys let go of your bitterness for a second, and really look at this rationally and THINK. And lonerj, your reference to understanding the KKK, do you really think the KKK wants anything to do with any minority, including you? You guys shoud also know that there are more whites living well below their means in America, yet this isnt because their parents and grandparents were poor b/c of segregration or hate at the hands of the government, its simply b/c of bad circumstances. THATS WHY BLACKS GET HELP. Whites have every oppurtunity to succeed in America. orSlavery and its aftermath with segregation, lynchings, and the KKK and everything was longer and worse than the Holocaust, Manifest Destiny, early American discrimination between immigrants. The effects of it are also the longest lasting and severe. Racism and hate against blacks is still very real, ITS A FACT.
 
z03 said:
Okay guys, look, this is the last post Im gonna make about this, because all the respones you guys make ive already answered.
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What fun is that? Conversation stimulates understanding.
 
I aint going to say much cos I already talked about race before and its a dead horse most the time, with VERY mixed and diverse opinions.
Heres a VERY small piece from me to add.

SOME Blacks play upon their race as an excuse in life, like it or not its a fact ya get some who abuse this and thats why theirs no real healing with some races these days cos of the few who abuse their colour as an excuse for summut they do or want.

I wonna also point out that these Blacks should look to the ASIAN cultures as motivation in life.
The Asians have had it just as hard as any Black culture IMHO, without going into URL links and endless worthless posting but they have, all the crap they have had ... the name calling cos of their apperance like Slitty Eyes, thats very offensive to the Asians as Nigga is to the Blacks.
Yet ya dont see them moaning about it, nor do they use their race as an excuse for their actions ..... they simply get their head down and get on with it, these Blacks should take a note out of the Asians books and act upon it than Bridges can be built in SOME societys especially like that of the UK where feelings are running high.

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Thats all I have to say on the subject, I have commented enough on this in the past and have had enough to a certain extent with it cos I wont be Prime Minister, so I cant ever change what goes in MY country.
 
This dialogue is Great! Unfortunately some of us Black and White have our minds made up on all issues at hand and our not open to change.

I have read alot of fueled statements and it is unfortunate that this is the time we live in. Change is only made through intelligent open minded discussions and actions.

I can only speak for myself and my life as a young Black man. I don't think White America owes me anything! Forget 40 acres and a mule! I'll get that on my own. Just like any other person out here Black, White, Red, Yellow, and Purple most people just want to be given a fair chance at success.

I am originally from Yonkers, NY and moved to North Carolina at a young age. That is where I really started to notice racism. The town was rather small and still to this day has the KKK in the phone book 919-492-7000.

I lived in this town with no Indians, Jamaicans, Latinos, Asians, or anybody except Black Americans and White Americans. NO VARIETY! A town where a little boy no older than 5 yrs looked at me and said "hey mommy look a nigger!"

No I don't have any complaints about being Forced to study Candian history all of my 5th grade year, Spanish history all of 7 and 8th, along with US and European history from the second - 11th grade. I also don't have any complaints about my world history teacher that failed me because I voiced my opinion. European history was World history to her! I asked her could we talk about African history for 1 week during OUR special month. She said yes and began this speech about slavery! Yes little black boy your history starts as a damn slave in the US. Forget your ancestors! Why because she probably doesn't know a damn thing about me or my ancestors. That's when everything changed for me! I stopped looking for other people to teach me about myself.

When you know where you come from and have a sense of pride everything else falls into place. A person of another race can't call me a racial slur and get me bent out of shape! It won't happen. I have a good 70-100 yrs to live if I take good care of myself and it just seems like yesterday I was playing on the swing set, now I'm almost 30. I don't have time to fuck with simple people. I got to make this money and enjoy the time I have here.

On another note I think we should all really practice tolerance and try to get out more. I know damn well you can't really think all white people are racist and black people think they are better than you. My business partner has got to be the coolest white guy in history. The "Son of Sam" was my neighbor. A white cop killed my cousin who was a Navy officer who I could never get to drink a beer or smoke a joint. Measure the Man! You can't hold a whole race accountable for ones actions.

Alright I'm tired! Guess I'll attend today's Black panther march or the klan meeting.
 
"the name calling cos of their apperance like Slitty Eyes, thats very offensive to the Asians as Nigga is to the Blacks."

come on man, being called "slitty eyes" is nothing compared to being called a nigger and half of it only deals with appearance. nigger goes back to slavery meaning that you are piece of machinery, a second class human being b/c you are black. saying slitty eyes is like calling scandinavian people blondie and is mean but is really only superficial and not as bad.

"The Asians have had it just as hard as any Black culture IMHO"

i really dont agree with that.
 
blue1214198203 said:
"the name calling cos of their apperance like Slitty Eyes, thats very offensive to the Asians as Nigga is to the Blacks."

come on man, being called "slitty eyes" is nothing compared to being called a nigger and half of it only deals with appearance. nigger goes back to slavery meaning that you are piece of machinery, a second class human being b/c you are black. saying slitty eyes is like calling scandinavian people blondie and is mean but is really only superficial and not as bad.

"The Asians have had it just as hard as any Black culture IMHO"

i really dont agree with that.
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Oh my gosh, that is so typical of Americans (no matter what race) to trivialize the plight of less visible minorities. You need to realize that the issue of race and racism in America is less and less 'black and white'. In fact, hispanics have supplanted blacks as the largest minority group just last year, and this will continue to sway in their direction.


Asians *do* find it very hurtful when they are taunted about their eyes or other things that they cannot change - just as black people are hurt when people make fun of their flat, large noses and big lips and nappy hair. And surely, you've hear of words such as "Chink" and "Gook" and "Zipperhead" - they are EXACTLY in the same vein as "Nigger" and "Spic", but most people pay no heed because Asians and Asian-Americans aren't as visible a group as African Americans, most proably due to their immigrant status (like Mexican people).


I have a personal interest in Asian American issues because I have many friends and extended family members that are Asian. They get the shaft while black people are busy complaining about racism and white peoplare busy denying things or accusing of reverse-racism, and it SO isn't right. In fact, it makes me angry to see the kind of "brush-off" Asian people get. >:( When anyone ever mentions Asians or Asian-Americans, it's usually about Asian women are de-humanized pieces of meat/whores for the White Man, or about Asian men as little turds with no redeeming qualities as men. People - blacks AND whites - need to wake up to the reality that the world (and consequently the U.S.) is a rapidly changing place.



Oh yeah - I think the overall maturity level of people on this board is just amazing.... totally commendable. :) Excellent thread.
 
I'm not saying I agree with this, but I just thought I'd chime in on the reason why some racism is more ( I'm halfway asleep and cant think of the right word) talked about or regarded than others. And that is the Racism as a Tool of Power and Oppression theory. Immigrants, Asian in particular, are generally more "economically advantaged" than black Americans, among other things. A lot of people really think only people in disadvantaged positions can really be full victims of racism, and historically black Americans have been treated as second class citizens ( if citizens at all, to put it lightly). An analogy I could use, though not very well at this time, is that of (sexual) harassment. Its a lot more threatening if a person in a power position such as a male boss, makes sexual advances towards a female subordinate than just a female flirting around with a male co-worker. I mean Ive been sexually harrassed many times, but as a strong male I never felt threatened by it. Again my minds not 100% right now and I'm grasping at words and concepts, but I hope you at least get the drift of what I mean to say.
 
look, it all comes down to what has the U.S. govt. conciously done to impede the economic and social progress of asians, latinos, or whites as a whole in America, almost nothing. for blacks and native americans it is the complete opposite.
 
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blue1214198203 said:
look, it all comes down to what has the U.S. govt. conciously done to impede the economic and social progress of asians, latinos, or whites as a whole in America, almost nothing. for blacks and native americans it is the complete opposite.
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conciously and specifically.
 
In my area, we are about 40 miles from the beaches and almost every kid loves the water. In addition, we have many urban areas with many minorities. Almost every white male in my area has been stereotyped as "Surfer-dude, Jackass, Steve-O, Fratboy." by African Americans. Some guys are like this, but most caucasian males aren't. However, some people have played into this role and begin to act like a jackass. The whole point of this little statement is that if a myth holds on long enough, then people will begin to believe it as truth: as African American males tend to believe they have superior penises. There is a great quotation from the Scarlet Letter when Dimmesdale says something to the effect of, "One can only wear a mask for so long, until one becomes confused with which mask is one's real self."
 
blue1214198203 said:
"the name calling cos of their apperance like Slitty Eyes, thats very offensive to the Asians as Nigga is to the Blacks."

come on man, being called "slitty eyes" is nothing compared to being called a nigger and half of it only deals with appearance. nigger goes back to slavery meaning that you are piece of machinery, a second class human being b/c you are black. saying slitty eyes is like calling scandinavian people blondie and is mean but is really only superficial and not as bad.

"The Asians have had it just as hard as any Black culture IMHO"

i really dont agree with that.
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*warning* I like to use the f word and that's how I normally talk.

Look, I don't see the point in inadvertently showing off that your race went through more shit than any others. That's just dumb especially if YOU haven't went through it.

Every background has a fucking history of hate. How about the civil war in Korea N. vs S. in which the N. tried to be a communist nation. It was like George Orwell's 1984 but worse where if you spoke a word of your opinion you'd get shot. Everybody was brainwashed and controlled and many died for their faiths in religion as well. Do you know my fucking history? I don't think so.

My blood lived through those times as well as the Japanese war. The japanese also had their women raped, beat, etc. by the white settlers. You probably also know that mexicans get treated like shit in the US as well and more people are more racist to mexicans than they are toward blacks.

First of all, I'd like to say that I don't have slitty eyes and have round ones.

Secondly, a racial slur is a fucking racial slur. Don't give me your bullshit saying it's more okay to use a racial slur but using the n word is more offensive. You sir, deserve a kick in the balls.

I bet you barely know anything about your history and you're just a product of the black leaders' propaganda.


Abd bigbutnottoo, asians are not more "economically fucking advantaged". You think they came to this fucking country with a shitload of money? Most asians used their brain, perseverance and hardwork to get to the top. The majority of asians are poor (if you didn't know). Asians are working their way up towards the middle class through hardwork not through generations of wealth passed down to them. I don't care if asians are doing better than any other race because they fucking worked for it - period. Don't you dare use that as some lame excuse saying that asians have it better.
 
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z03 said:
Seriously, you guys let go of your bitterness for a second, and really look at this rationally and THINK. And lonerj, your reference to understanding the KKK, do you really think the KKK wants anything to do with any minority, including you? You guys shoud also know that there are more whites living well below their means in America, yet this isnt because their parents and grandparents were poor b/c of segregration or hate at the hands of the government, its simply b/c of bad circumstances. THATS WHY BLACKS GET HELP. Whites have every oppurtunity to succeed in America. orSlavery and its aftermath with segregation, lynchings, and the KKK and everything was longer and worse than the Holocaust, Manifest Destiny, early American discrimination between immigrants. The effects of it are also the longest lasting and severe. Racism and hate against blacks is still very real, ITS A FACT.
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I apologize for bringing the KKK thing into play. My point was to enter their minds to why they are like that and how I agree with one of their ideals (which is no reason to rationalize for their racism). I also tried to prove that they are brainwashed mindless racists. I should point out that it was pathetic of me to mention anything worthy of the KKK. I apologize.
 
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I have personally stopped looking at the world in terms of colour, as colour does not define a person. Personality defines a person.

I'm white, and i have met arsehole black people... but then i have also met arsehole white people. the same as i heave met awesome black people and awesome white people. Racism is stupid. If someone who is black starts shit, i don't tell them they are a fuckwit/loser/whatever cause they are black, i tell them they are a fuckwit/loser/whatever because that's what they are. Somehow though, other races automatically assume that one says these things because you are of a different race... I don't get it. Colour/race should not be an issue for ANY reason. We should all grow up and see past the small things such as skin colour.

I am aware that most of this post made limited sence, but i need sleep... sorry.
 
lonerj said:
*warning* I like to use the f word and that's how I normally talk.

Look, I don't see the point in inadvertently showing off that your race went through more shit than any others. That's just dumb especially if YOU haven't went through it.

Every background has a fucking history of hate. How about the civil war in Korea N. vs S. in which the N. tried to be a communist nation. It was like George Orwell's 1984 but worse where if you spoke a word of your opinion you'd get shot. Everybody was brainwashed and controlled and many died for their faiths in religion as well. Do you know my fucking history? I don't think so.

My blood lived through those times as well as the Japanese war. The japanese also had their women raped, beat, etc. by the white settlers. You probably also know that mexicans get treated like shit in the US as well and more people are more racist to mexicans than they are toward blacks.

First of all, I'd like to say that I don't have slitty eyes and have round ones.

Secondly, a racial slur is a fucking racial slur. Don't give me your bullshit saying it's more okay to use a racial slur but using the n word is more offensive. You sir, deserve a kick in the balls.

I bet you barely know anything about your history and you're just a product of the black leaders' propaganda.


Abd bigbutnottoo, asians are not more "economically fucking advantaged". You think they came to this fucking country with a shitload of money? Most asians used their brain, perseverance and hardwork to get to the top. The majority of asians are poor (if you didn't know). Asians are working their way up towards the middle class through hardwork not through generations of wealth passed down to them. I don't care if asians are doing better than any other race because they fucking worked for it - period. Don't you dare use that as some lame excuse saying that asians have it better.
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first, how do u know if im black or white or something else? ive never said i was either or.

second, im not showing off on anyone's behalf, i just think people like to undermine blacks suffering for the sake of seeming more intellectual or counterculture, but rationally the u.s. govt, not just ignorant people and localized racism, supported racism and hate across the nation persecuting blacks and native americans throughout the twentieth century which has had lasting effects up unitl today.

third, i was talking about america, not the whole world. and if asians are persecuting asians its really not the kind of racism were discussing.

fourth, how do u know latinos get treated worse than blacks? what do you base that on? and dont give me a localized respone like "where i grew up...," i want national trends and occurences that is common knowledge, like blacks not getting loans even though they meet all qualifications and the decision is basically founded in a negative stigma perpeuated by the aftermath of slavery.

fifth, i didnt say using any racial slur was okay, i only said that nigger is more offensive because it goes deeper than superficial characteristics. and the kick in the balls comment was really stupid.

sixth, what you said about me not knowing black history and being a product of black leader's "propaganda" is totally unfounded since ive made two posts in this topic and one was opinion and the other was based on facts, and again you dont know what race i am.

seventh, asians did come over as immigrants and build themselves up, but they were given a decent starting point. a lot of asian immigrants come to america with something and some sort of financial security carrying over from asia as with most immigrants. after slavery blacks had nothing and segregration going on until the 60s and the subsequent racism and negative stigmas forced on blacks in terms of intelligence and morality afterwards has slowed blacks progress even more. just recently have things begun to even out.

eigth, "blacks eat a lot of fast food and do drugs", um, most people who live in poor areas do that no matter what race.

ninth, i really think you are ignoring what people are saying and are just resonding as quick as possible with personal horror stories that any minority living in poverty stricken areas has without considering the nation as a whole and looking at things rationally and comparing the severity of slavery and segregation and hate against blacks compared to the other forms of racism that other minorities have experienced in america and how it has affected their economic development in comparison to whites.

tenth, in terms of general racism what stereotypes do the major races have?
blacks: ignorant, immoral, violent, athletic, big dick, rytHydromaxic and soulful
whites: smart, moral, not especially athletic, average dick, boring/uptight
latinos: ignorant, poor, large families, good at soccer, close to heritage
asians: really smart, good work ethic, short, small dick, competitive, not especially athletic, close to heritage

tenth, youre a spaz and after reading your posts i think you just dont like black people, and are the only racist, hate fueled person posting in this topic.
 
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