DLD: An observation on pre-PE size

>>>>No disrespect to you...but I am stickin to ma guns

That's cool.


>>>A saying.... 'Life will find a way' / 'Life will evolve' comes into effect here IMO.


No, it doesn't.

Evolution involves the passing on of genetically determined traits.

Penis Enlargement is environmental, i.e., not genetic.





>>Theirs an island I cant remember where.
>>>But theirs like shit loadz of finches their.
<>>Now we all know they eat seed.
><>>>But these finches many 1000's of years ago ran outta this food.
>>>>So they evolved to eat blood from other animals.
>>>>Its true...I saw a program on it.
>>>>These finches eat and drink blood.



Correct. The finches that could survive on blood lived and passed on their traits. Over time, the ones that could thrive best on blood were favored.

This has nothing to do with an individual adapting itself to eating blood, then passing on those blood-eating abilities to his descendants.

This has to do with some finches being naturally a little better at living off of blood than other finches, surviving when others couldn't and passing on those traits to their descendants.




>>>When these finches hatch outta the eggs their instinct it to >>>>drink blood...not the seeds they would crave milleniums ago.



Because all the finches who couldn't live on blood died.


>>>But I dont want some huge argument or debate over this.
>>>>Its in the wrong subject anyhow....but its MHO based on >>>>facts I have gathred.


Don't take this personally, but it's against all evolutionary theory and there's not a biologist in the world who would agree with your take on what happened with the finches.


Now, will someone please tell me about their pre Penis Enlargement size and their choice of underwear?

...and the THREAD Heats up!

Originally posted by Metal Ed
Yes, I will jump out of my chair and say "impossible." That is hogwash. There is no such thing as inheritance of acquired characteristics. Sorry.

You either saw a true natural freak, or a guy who had done lots of Penis Enlargement himself. Whether or not his ancestors did it has no bearing on his size.

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Agreed. The only thing that could have a "generational" effect would be a culture of selection - where only/mostly big-dicked males were sought as mates. This would gradually weed out the little-dicked guys. But nothing you do after birth could have any effect, genetically, on your offspring - unless, of course, you received some type of contamination (LSD, radiation, etc.) which caused damage to your DNA - but this, of course, would do nothing for dick size.

Originally posted by doublelongdaddy
In some families they may be taught Penis Enlargement by their fathers and told never to say the better of it. In this case some guys who are huge may Penis Enlargement but will never admit it. The penis comes in all shapes and sizes but I truly believe 99% of the men in the world who are not victim to some defect or privy to Penis Enlargement are between the range of upper 4" to lower 7".

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Again, we're back to the "if he's big, he must've Penis Enlargement'd" syndrome. It's circuitous reasoning, with nothing substantial to back it up.
Furthermore, your estimate of "99% of the men in the world...being between 4-plus to the low 7's" goes against every study that I've ever read.
The most common & most reputable seem to indicate that 83% of men are between 5 to 7 inches erect. But that leaves 17% who are not. I seem to recall that 4 or 5% were below 5", but that leaves 12-13% above 7 inches. I believe the number who possessed 8" or more was only about 6-7% of the population. However, from what you wrote, you seem to be saying the number of guys above the "lower 7" are less than 1%. The less-than-1% group was in the 9-plus range. Which I think is probably accurate, making my experiences with those 2 guys fit right in (2 at 9-10" out of 500 males, is about 1/2 percent).
I would also dispute your "hidden society of Penis Enlargement'ers." If that were remotely the case, there would not be so much ignorance regarding Penis Enlargement, and the fact that nobody (outside of our communities) even remotely believes that this stuff would work.
Also, why would the Penis Enlargement paysites abound & profit so much money if this is already common knowledge? It became more "common" after the advent of the Internet, but I bet the number of guys who do this is phenomenally rare - probably more rare than a natural 10-incher.
Also, notice what we've done....we've taken this subject beyond the realm of reason:
(1) If we see a big flaccid hang, our mind is just playing tricks on us [optical illusion]
(2) If a woman describes lovers with huge dongs, she is just bad at guessing size [inaccurate size estimate] or she's exaggerating [deception].
(3) If we see a huge dong in the �naked people movies�os, he either Penis Enlargement'd [begging the question], is augmented by special lenses/small women [optical illusions again or commercial fraud/deception].
Philosophers have written about the epic battle of Reason vs. Irrationality....such obstinacy cannot be combatted by Reason. Only when 2 minds are genuinely open can there be a worthwhile intellectual exchange.
Red says I've somehow been proven wrong, but then he relates a guy with a 12" cock (which I'm sure DLD would dispute), then he somehow believes that cock was "genetically" passed down through the ages.
Okay....what's on T.V. anyway?

Originally posted by WaxN
(1) If we see a big flaccid hang, our mind is just playing tricks on us [optical illusion]

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This is not what I said. I stated that many men make the assumption that if a guy has a big flaccid hang that he has huge erect size. Another point on this matter the 2 men you saw in the locker-room did you measure them? DId you witness there erect 9 and 10 inch penis? or did you make an assumption based on their flaccid size? Was there a ruler handy?

Originally posted by WaxN
(2) If a woman describes lovers with huge dongs, she is just bad at guessing size [inaccurate size estimate] or she's exaggerating [deception].

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of course. Try this experiment....I have many times. The next girl that talks about this guy with a HUGE dong and quotes a size ask her to draw a line to this effect. Everytime I have done this the women was off by inches!

Originally posted by WaxN
(3) If we see a huge dong in the �naked people movies�os, he either Penis Enlargement'd [begging the question], is augmented by special lenses/small women [optical illusions again or commercial fraud/deception].

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I have already proven this in my study. The �naked people movies� market is obsessed with big dick �naked people movies�. You think they go out and get a huge girl with gigantic hands and a regular lens when they can do the opposite and make a big dick look larger than life. If this was the case my study would be worthless. I have asked these questions from a NY Adult Film Producer (a Friend of JAZ) and the first thing he mentioned was the Ultra Wide Angle Zoom. Second was tiny females. Case in point __________ (I will post these pics for everyone to see) I have seen him look 14" long with the right conditions, I have seen him look smaller than 8 with the wrong environment.

Originally posted by WaxN
Philosophers have written about the epic battle of Reason vs. Irrationality....such obstinacy cannot be combatted by Reason. Only when 2 minds are genuinely open can there be a worthwhile intellectual exchange.
Red says I've somehow been proven wrong, but then he relates a guy with a 12" cock (which I'm sure DLD would dispute), then he somehow believes that cock was "genetically" passed down through the ages.
Okay....what's on T.V. anyway?

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WaxN I am very open to your views as a matter of fact I encourage them. Do I dispute a 12" penis...Until I see it with my own eyes and a ruler I do.

DLD, check these out....

http://www.sizesurvey.com/result.html

2,545 subjects

Penis EnlargementRCENTILE FLACCID ERECT CIRCUMFERENCE
0 25(1.0") 68(2.7") 60(2.4")
10 50(2.0") 125(4.9") 95(3.7")
20 60(2.4") 140(5.5") 110(4.3")
30 73(2.9") 147(5.8") 120(4.7")
40 80(3.1") 152(6.0") 125(4.9")
50 88(3.5") 160(6.3") 130(5.1")
60 95(3.7") 170(6.7") 134(5.3")
70 100(3.9") 176(6.9") 140(5.5")
80 110(4.3") 185(7.3") 150(5.9")
90 120(4.7") 200(7.9") 160(6.3")
100 157(6.2") 260(10.2") 205(8.1")


Also note that these are NOT BP, as evidenced by the photo example.
Also, few blacks were included in the survey, but the follow up is being conducted in the D.C. area, so those NBP sizes should be pushed up even higher.
But just the above survey indicates that roughly 20% of men were 7.3" NBP or more; 10% were 7.9% BP or more. With NBP measurements up to 10.2"

http://www.penis-size-facts.com/penis-size-facts.html

This survey is also NBP - and the numbers are also much higher than you state. Above 7.26" NBP is 5.7% (not 1%). And these are NBP not BP (I have a full inch fatpad, so it's conceivable that the above numbers could easily be 8 - 8.25" BPenis EnlargementL or bigger is 5.7%).

WaxN I have studied these surveys extensively and all but one is really useless for one reason. The subjects measured themselves.

The one study I did like that was accurate, is Lifestyles Condoms survey. I think it left the smallest amount of error. In the Spring 2001 in Cancun, Mexico, Lifestyles gathered a total of 301 male volunteers over 18 years old. Each subject was measured by a researcher, which eliminated the cheating factor. The results of the Lifestyles survey found that average penis erect length is 5.87 inches and erect girth is 4.97 inches. Also, according to the survey, 54% of subjects measured between 5.5 inches and 6.3 inches in erect length with 53.3% measuring between 4.72 inches and 5.11 inches in girth.

Mow as far as photography and illusion are concerned I used a picture you posted where you stated "Here's a still of some guy with a monster cock...he must be near a foot long & at least 7" around.... I coupled that picture with one from a less illusionary shoot. You be the judge but I think it's safe to say he is not a foot long. The model here is __________.

The picture on the left is a flat regular lens. The picture on the right is a Ultra Wide Angle Zoom...The same penis.

Originally posted by doublelongdaddy
Another point on this matter the 2 men you saw in the locker-room did you measure them? DId you witness there erect 9 and 10 inch penis? or did you make an assumption based on their flaccid size? Was there a ruler handy?

....

The next girl that talks about this guy with a HUGE dong and quotes a size ask her to draw a line to this effect. Everytime I have done this the women was off by inches!

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Sorry, I missed these. As to my buddies, I never saw the guy with 9 erect, but he honestly was 7.5-8 flaccid in the lockerroom - he really hung low & flopped around. The guy with 10" I saw erect at parties many times - when he would get drunk he would whip it out & bounce it up and down with his thumbs, like a diving board. No ruler was present, but DAMN was he big. He was almost my exact height, body size, etc., and I was 6.5" BPenis EnlargementL at the time; he was damn-sure at least 3.5" longer than me, and I would guess my present girth (6.25") or more.
Regarding the line-drawing experiment, I think that's misleading. A line, due to it's thinness (-----------------------------------) would tend to look longer than it really is, causing a girl to under-draw her estimate. I've seen gals give a more reliable estimate using their hands. One made a fist and said to her girlfriend, in front of me, he was about this long (and held one hand about 3" above her fist), showing a length of about 6.25-6.5" (assuming her fist was about 3.25" across). But I saw one girl once put both fists together and indicate that his head, and some shaft, was still exposed - that had to put her boyfriend at easily more than 8" erect.
But, here's the dilemma....you don't believe women's accounts, you're suspicious of camera lenses & angles, and you don't seem to subscribe to the prevailing surveys.....
What's left? Guessing? I'm sure not going to embark on a dick-sucking journey to find out for myself, LOL.

Originally posted by WaxN
you don't believe women's accounts, you're suspicious of camera lenses & angles, and you don't seem to subscribe to the prevailing surveys.....
What's left? Guessing? I'm sure not going to embark on a dick-sucking journey to find out for myself, LOL.

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But all of the above mentioned items are guesses. I require proof. Some girl saying it looked 10" really is not concrete nor is a camera view (see the picture I posted) Surveys I have always disputed (see my last post) We need to slow down were missing each others posts lol.

Regarding the __________ pics, I blurted out the 12 x 7 because I was shocked by his size, never saw him before. But he could be a tiny guy (John Holmes, for example, was tall). But the pic I sent was a still from a video - so I saw his cock in action. The other pic you posted doesn't even look like the same cock (I'm not saying it isn't), so I'd guess that there was a different level of arousal. Think of your cock at 90%, 95%, etc.
I'd bet my life, however, that there's no way in hell that he's "only 8 inches." Like I said, I saw the video of that woman sucking it. He was also screwing her in a weird position - she had her knees drawn up, while he was laying on his side, at her bottom. He wasn't even up against her, he was thrusting rapidly & he never fell out. I doubt the video was shot with a wide-angle lense with too much distortion since nothing else in the video picture looked skewed (for example, her pussy or his balls didn't look gigantic - just his cock).
But I don't honestly think he was 12 x 7, just as I'm sure he's not just 8 or 9 inches either.

Originally posted by WaxN
But I don't honestly think he was 12 x 7, just as I'm sure he's not just 8 or 9 inches either.

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and this is the main problem with video and pictures...WE DON'T KNOW FOR SURE. I did not do my study to dispute that gigantic cocks are in the world nor did I do it to prove every hung guy does Penis Enlargement. I did the study to calm my own anxiety in the �naked people movies� world and as I worked on it I found out allot about dick size. I brought my data to you guys to help calm your anxieties and create more realistic goals.

Are there huge cocks out there? Of course...What is huge? In my opinion 7 to 8 inches is monster. Jen has slept with many men (sorry hun) in her insatiable quest she came across one monster a guy who was the size of a standard US FleshLight...7x6. Look at a FleshLight....It is HUGE. My point is HUGE can sometimes be synonymous with exaggerated size estimates. There is so much room for errorr in video, word of mouth, pictures, etc. The only way to be sure is to measure the penis yourself...which I had to go through with GQ magazine and it's not pleasant.

THe most important message my study was meant to invoke was this; We have the potential to be the biggest out there. Fuck studies, fuck he said she said shit...We own the secret and we are creating our own bell curve

I must say, DLD, you are the David Hume of the dick world: you believe neither eyewitness accounts, surveys, or cameras - just sort of an a priori knowledge of penis size.
I must bow to such discriminating skepticism - you are the cock connoisseur par excellence ("cockoisseur"). I should prefer the destruction of my favorite ruler, than to disbelieve the limits of "human understanding" by accepting the value of the numbered gradients.....whatever that means.
Cheers...
I must be off for my Blasters (kudos for the exercise).

Originally posted by WaxN
I must say, DLD, you are the David Hume of the dick world: you believe neither eyewitness accounts, surveys, or cameras - just sort of an a priori knowledge of penis size.
I must bow to such discriminating skepticism - you are the cock connoisseur par excellence ("cockoisseur"). I should prefer the destruction of my favorite ruler, than to disbelieve the limits of "human understanding" by accepting the value of the numbered gradients.....whatever that means.
Cheers...
I must be off for my Blasters (kudos for the exercise).

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...and I bow to your intelligent debate.

I've heard Finches Tast like Chicken.

Originally posted by WaxN
Agreed. The only thing that could have a "generational" effect would be a culture of selection - where only/mostly big-dicked males were sought as mates. This would gradually weed out the little-dicked guys. But nothing you do after birth could have any effect, genetically, on your offspring - unless, of course, you received some type of contamination (LSD, radiation, etc.) which caused damage to your DNA - but this, of course, would do nothing for dick size.

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Wad!

This is a first!

We *agree*!

Think..... we had to debate atheism, Hitler, the efficacy of pumping (which I am still trying to determine, myself), Barry Bonds and Babe Ruth, before finding common ground.

And here's one more thing we agree on: I do think that there are natural 9, 10's and even 11's out there. Just exceedingly rare. I don't agree with DLD that everyone who's huge has to have Penis Enlargement'd.

However, I do think that DLD is on to something when he says that some of the folks who start Penis Enlargement a little bit above average (the 7 inch guys) may have inadvertently done some Penis Enlargement in their youth without knowing it. I'm not saying ALL - and I'm sure some guys are just naturally blessed with 7 x 5.7 the same way others are naturally blessed with 10 x 7' - but I think SOME.

In my case, I know now that I did a lot of partially erect squeezes and bends during my youth, all without realizing it at the time. It just happened and since it didn't hurt or kill my dick, I just let it keep happening.

I'm not saying it had a *huge* effect but I wonder if this is why I started at 7 x 5.7 rather than 6 x 5.

Heck, maybe it didn't do a damn thing at all, or maybe it did. I have no way of knowin for sure, unless I clone myself and raise little Ed-prime, only buying him boxers and forbiding him to sleep through the urge to urinate ("Ed-prime! Wake up! It's dad! Go pee!") and then measuring his wee-wee when he's all grown up.

I'm just throwing out some ideas and livening up the board.

Originally posted by Metal Ed
I don't agree with DLD that everyone who's huge has to have Penis Enlargement'd.

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Where did I make this difinitive statement? Is this a quote? I plead the 5th but seriously, I don't think I ever made this statement :

Originally posted by Metal Ed
I'm just throwing out some ideas and livening up the board.

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...and you are doing a fine job of this. Thanks for your involvement in this topic!

I am still stickin to ma guns
No offense but none of us are professors or anything....so what we say is our own opinion...hopefully based on fact.

I am convinced that over a long time it can be inherited,
I think you a misreading this and thinking a few 100 years....I am talking MANY 1000's of reguler years exercising.
I think that slowly [VERY] this will somehow effect the genes,,,,I dunno how but IMHO I think it will.

I dont care what you say your just a normal guy not a Biologist or anything like a Proffesor so I'll stick to what I think.

I do think that naturally big born guys are extremely rare. So, my opinion is that much less than half of the big dicks are natural and the rest are Penis Enlargementd ones. IOW, there are many huge dicks for sure and a majority of them are Penis Enlargementd ones while the rest minority are all natural.

I also reckon that most BIGGER men some of us see in �naked people movies�....look bigger than they are as its our mind telling us their MUCH bigger than they are as we aint as large as them.

Plus imagery and video aint the best way of telling size accurate at all.
Even going of a girls hands, head and build etc aint accurate as they all vary.

At the end of the day we must GUESS GUESS GUESS and agree to disagree on this one.

We will only know the REAL size of __________ and Lex if they have a ruler rammed into their abs along their shaft......and ya know what??? I reckon they will not be as big as some of us think.

That picture of __________......the girl has TINY TINY hands.
I'd say his penis is 8.2/8.5 inches long.
With the girth in the 6 range somewhere.

Still Big but not 12 inches like before.

Another thing with �naked people movies�....they want to sell the film.....alas it must look convincing....it must work some of you think its bigger than it is....easy to do....the buisness want this.

I think you are wrong regarding inheritance over 1000 of generations by doing Penis Enlargement. The only way that genes for "a bigger dick" would be passed is if the father has these genes. He would have gotten them from his father (meaning a man without pe gains) or because of a mutation (meaning that the genes from his father did not have any effect). This would be the same even after 1000 of generations.

A question to DLD. The guy in this film, is it __________? Also, what would be his estimated size (length and girth)?

http://www.sexvidz.com/movies/DIV00011.MPG

Priapos