Damn brother, that was one long post...
I'll try to explain myself further and possibly address some of your points.
The reason i feel that Androgel is a waste is that if the person that claimed to make great gains from it was using propper dosades as prescribed on it's literature, he was only getting a daily dose of test at either 50mg, 75mg or 100mg depending whether he was prescribed the 5g, 7.5g, or 10g Androgel. Even if he doubled the dose that is still a far cry from what is considered a low dose amoung steroid users. Now if you consider that the actual absorbtion rate of a good transdermals is around 20-50%, then you can see how little actual test you're going to get from androgel. The test contained in Androgel is test base or unesterfied test. Test base has a very short half-life in the body, somewhere in the neighborhood of 12-24 hours. This is why it must be applied at least once a day (bodybuilders that use transdermals typically use 10 times that dose applied several times a day). Most steroid injectables use esterfied test. Esters like cypionate, enanthate, propinate, decanoate, etc. allow the test to be released much slower allowing the test to remaim in the body much longer. It effectively extends the half-life from one day all the way to 20 days or longer. So if a bodybuilder such as myself was taking 10 to 20 times the dose of this person, my dick should be a foot long by now... but it isn't. In fact, i didn't notice any significant gains from Penis Enlargement while is was on IGF-1 and/or steroids. There have also been others on this board that have agreed with me on this.
Another point i'd like to make about testosterone is that directly applying it to any tissue is pointless. No tissue (exo skeletal muscle or cavernous smooth muscle cells) can make direct use of test. Test exerts its effect on muscles thru increased protein synthesis, so you can rub all the test in the world on your dick and nothing will happen. This is why i kept on harping on the local vs. systemic issue. Anyone who claims that rubbing Androgel on your dick will make it bigger is agruing for localized effect which is BS. but even from a systemic perspective, Androgel just does not apply enough test to make much of a difference. I don't care what anyone has to say about making gains from Androgel, it just does not add up.
I believe that gains made from Androgel are due to the power of positive thinking. They hear that other people make gains with it so they apply it and can't help but to work harder. They do in fact make gains but not because of the Androgel but from their efforts. I wonder if the guy who claims to have made great gains from Androgel was an experienced Penis Enlargement'er or was he a beginner... also did he change his routine or do anything different. There are also some that are just fast gainers and whether he used Andrgel or not, he could have made the same gains.
Here's supra's thread... http://www.mattersofsize.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5540&highlight=igf-1
Science has proved time and again that tugging on skin, muscles, and ligature does in fact cause them to expand and lengthen. Rubbing Androjel and claiming that it made you dick bigger is not science and in fact contradictory to how testosterone affects tissues.
I'll try to explain myself further and possibly address some of your points.
The reason i feel that Androgel is a waste is that if the person that claimed to make great gains from it was using propper dosades as prescribed on it's literature, he was only getting a daily dose of test at either 50mg, 75mg or 100mg depending whether he was prescribed the 5g, 7.5g, or 10g Androgel. Even if he doubled the dose that is still a far cry from what is considered a low dose amoung steroid users. Now if you consider that the actual absorbtion rate of a good transdermals is around 20-50%, then you can see how little actual test you're going to get from androgel. The test contained in Androgel is test base or unesterfied test. Test base has a very short half-life in the body, somewhere in the neighborhood of 12-24 hours. This is why it must be applied at least once a day (bodybuilders that use transdermals typically use 10 times that dose applied several times a day). Most steroid injectables use esterfied test. Esters like cypionate, enanthate, propinate, decanoate, etc. allow the test to be released much slower allowing the test to remaim in the body much longer. It effectively extends the half-life from one day all the way to 20 days or longer. So if a bodybuilder such as myself was taking 10 to 20 times the dose of this person, my dick should be a foot long by now... but it isn't. In fact, i didn't notice any significant gains from Penis Enlargement while is was on IGF-1 and/or steroids. There have also been others on this board that have agreed with me on this.
Another point i'd like to make about testosterone is that directly applying it to any tissue is pointless. No tissue (exo skeletal muscle or cavernous smooth muscle cells) can make direct use of test. Test exerts its effect on muscles thru increased protein synthesis, so you can rub all the test in the world on your dick and nothing will happen. This is why i kept on harping on the local vs. systemic issue. Anyone who claims that rubbing Androgel on your dick will make it bigger is agruing for localized effect which is BS. but even from a systemic perspective, Androgel just does not apply enough test to make much of a difference. I don't care what anyone has to say about making gains from Androgel, it just does not add up.
I believe that gains made from Androgel are due to the power of positive thinking. They hear that other people make gains with it so they apply it and can't help but to work harder. They do in fact make gains but not because of the Androgel but from their efforts. I wonder if the guy who claims to have made great gains from Androgel was an experienced Penis Enlargement'er or was he a beginner... also did he change his routine or do anything different. There are also some that are just fast gainers and whether he used Andrgel or not, he could have made the same gains.
Alternate said:
Here's supra's thread... http://www.mattersofsize.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5540&highlight=igf-1
Yes this is true but they have all been debunked by science...
You don't want to increase DHT... it has alot of associated side effects that makes it hard to justify. The more severe sides include: androgenic alopecia (male pattern baldness), increased aggresion, and Benign Prostrate Hypertrophy.
Science has proved time and again that tugging on skin, muscles, and ligature does in fact cause them to expand and lengthen. Rubbing Androjel and claiming that it made you dick bigger is not science and in fact contradictory to how testosterone affects tissues.
Yes this is true but we have to put these studies in perspective. Any IGF/HGH study on growth that is performed on prenatal or the young does little for us as the primary role of IGF/HGH in children is to make them grow into adulthood. If you inject HGH in children, they will grow into very tall adults. This has been proven time and again, in fact it is the therapy used on undersized children. That said, if you apply the same therapy to an adult he/she does not get any bigger or taller.
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