Nolove;686288 said:
Very true on the nbpel. I think its more the aesthetics of looking bigger than bpel. The measuring issue I only have is when i do any kind on measuring(both NBPEL and BPEL), when i look down from different angles its shorter or longer. Maybe its the transparent ruler I have.

Yeah NBPEL will fluctuate too much. If you need help with the fat pad hit me up
 
lightlyfried;686435 said:
Yeah NBPEL will fluctuate too much. If you need help with the fat pad hit me up

Exactly correct. Of course we all want a much longer, non-bone pressed erection and this will come but the only way to chart the measurements is by anchoring against the pubic bone or all you will be doing is guessing.
 
doublelongdaddy;686527 said:
Exactly correct. Of course we all want a much longer, non-bone pressed erection and this will come but the only way to chart the measurements is by anchoring against the pubic bone or all you will be doing is guessing.

and nbpel is the length of your penis, it's just hidden under fat, but if you're 8bpel your penis is 8 inches.
 
lightlyfried;686589 said:
and nbpel is the length of your penis, it's just hidden under fat, but if you're 8bpel your penis is 8 inches.
Thats true. Its just ive been bulking for the past year and a half. Gained like a good 10 lbs of muscle mass, but still failed to reach my weight goal of 185(currently 173). I might cut though for the summer.

doublelongdaddy;686527 said:
Exactly correct. Of course we all want a much longer, non-bone pressed erection and this will come but the only way to chart the measurements is by anchoring against the pubic bone or all you will be doing is guessing.
yeah, its just when i look down at the measurment, the angels vary my BPEL.
 
Nolove;686718 said:
Thats true. Its just ive been bulking for the past year and a half. Gained like a good 10 lbs of muscle mass, but still failed to reach my weight goal of 185(currently 173). I might cut though for the summer.

yeah, its just when i look down at the measurment, the angels vary my BPEL.

Yeah, I'm cutting at the minuet - take longer than you think you'll need. Trust me, thank me later lol
 
Good luck on the cut man. I start march and hopefully ill quit smoking too. According to stats, ill end up around 160 with around 8-10% BF. Anyways I just finish winter classes, and start spring classes in 2 weeks. Once march comes, im planning on 1h hanging per day with atleast 3 hours extending.Pumping will be thrown in when I can.

2-15
5 min basic stretching
2h extedning
4 min erect stretches
PM
20 min hanging @10 lbs
3h extending
2-16
5 min basic
4h extending
pm
20 min hanging @ 10lbs
2h extending
2-17(Class)
5 min stretching
2h extneding

2-18
5 min basic stretching
2h extending
3 min erect stretches
pm
5 min bundle
2h extendning
2-19
5 min basic stretching
1h extending
3 min basic stretching
1h extending
pm
5 min bundle
20 min haning at 10 lbs
2h extending

BPFSL is between 22cm and 22.5 cm now.- Still making BPFSL gains, even with the same bars as last month. Sadly, i tried to increase bare length, but keep slipping meaning BPFSL is still too short for it.
 
Last edited:
lightlyfried;686589 said:
and nbpel is the length of your penis, it's just hidden under fat, but if you're 8bpel your penis is 8 inches.

Right.
 
I know I havent updated sorry, but i will be updated shortly. First, im a few days from measurement date and confident ill hit 8 bpel..i hope. New photos ill update is a new wrapping method im trying plus a photo of bundled(360) extending photo. Sorry for the hair also.lol.
As for the new wrap, i use the whole roll, wrap it as long as my erections maybe a tad bit longer. What i notice is a stretch thats slightly less than a low tension [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]extender[/words] position with more mobility that i need. It in fact does make me sore and just an addition to my hanging/extending/stretching/regular warping.
 
Last edited:
2-20
2x10 hanging @10 lbs
2h extending
pm
20 mins hanging @10 lbs
2h extending
2-21
10 mins hanging @10lbs
2h extewndinf
15 mins pumpinng
2x10 min clamping
2-22
10 mins hanging @10 lbs
3h extending
pm
10 mins hanging @10 lbs
2h extending
2-23
10 mins hanging @10 lbs
10 mins hanging @ 7.5
1h exteding
5 min bassic stretching
2h extendingf
2-24
5 min basic stretching
1h exteending
pm
20 mins hanging @ 10 lbs
2h extending
2-25
2x20 mins hganging @ 10 lbs
2h extending
pm
5 min basic stretching
1h extending
6 min bundle
1h extending
2-26
20 mins hanging @ 10 lbs
20 mins hanging @ 7.5 lbs
2h extending
pm
8 min bundle
1 h extending

Goal is to hang more. It should be more effective than extending for 5+ hours. But what do you guys think? hang more or extend more?
 
2-27
20 mins haning @ 10 lbs
10 min extending
20 mins hanging @ 10 lbs
1h extending
pm
5 min basic stretching
2h extending
2-28
2x20 min hanging @ 10lbs
1h extending

2-29
Measuring day as arrived!!!!! With a quick measurement upon waking up and a little adult entertainment my new BPEL is now.......................8 inches...My nbpel was over 7.25 but erection was getting weaker. Im pretty shocked actually. Since my erection wasnt that high, or couldve been my eyes, ill remeasure again today or whenever my erection seems the hardest to confirm again.
 
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Wow, congratulations my Brother, what a wonderful milestone! Use these gains to influence and inspire the next gains and please, keep on inspiring the Brotherhood!
 
Thank you and will for sure try to inspire others!
2-27
20 mins hanging @ 10 lbs
10 min extending(interrupted)
20 mins hanging @ 10 lbs
1h extending
pm
5 mins basic stretching
2h extending
2-28
2x20 mins hanging @ 10 lbs
1h extending
2-29
2x20 mins hanging @ 10 lbs
1h extending
pm
5 min basic stretching
2h extending

2-29
2x20 mins hanging @ 10 lbs
2h extending
pm
6 min bundle
2h extending
3-1
2x20 mins hanging @ 10 lbs
2h extending
pm
20 mins hanging @ 7.5 lbs
3h extending
3-2
2x20 mins hanging @ 10 lbs
1h extending
pm
5 min bunndle
2h extending

What do you guys think? Need more extending?
Today i was super sore and skipped the AM session and about to start my first hanging session @ 11lbs
(update): after hanging I just realized my [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]extender[/words] kinda snapped out of pace at the base......... Maybe I should've posted more to win that February contest =(
 
Last edited:
If you bought your [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]SizeGenetics[/words] through us there is a warranty you could use to get a replacement.
 
Sorry for the departure! but im back. Ive been hanging almost everyday about 30min-50 mins per day with atleast 1/2 hours of extending. Last week I checked my BPFSL and still stuck under 23CM. Ill try screen shot my past routines.
 
Nolove;691690 said:
Sorry for the departure! but im back. Ive been hanging almost everyday about 30min-50 mins per day with atleast 1/2 hours of extending. Last week I checked my BPFSL and still stuck under 23CM. Ill try screen shot my past routines.

Good to see you back! Maybe you need to change up the routine a bit to get gains to jump start. Whenever I found myself at a plateau like this I would always go back to the [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/forum/penis-enlargement-newbie-forum/1597-dlds-first-routine-i-gained-2-inches-with-this-routine-full-tutorial.html]Newbie Routine[/words] for about 14 days and from there jump into a revised, more intense workout, like [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/forum/showthread.php?64036-My-Best-Work-Ever-Penis-Enlargement-will-Be-Changed-Forever-gt-gt-Gain%20inches%20with%20SRT-Theory-and-Routine]SRT[/words]. Sometime the penis becomes accustomed to an exercise, routine or tool and intensity needs to increase or change needs to happen. So good to see you back and I hope to see that 23cm jump to 30!
 
^Really trying to increase my hanging time to breakthrough. The 10 hours a week is tougher than I imagined ha. Only thing is that my NBPEL from using a tape measure shows above 7.5. I broke my ruler so once May comes, ill remeasure .
 
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Photos below is my routine . Not as organized, but still making counting my time under tension so I can manage to progress.
 
Still doing 40mins a day hanging adding .5lbs every 2 weeks. Im at 13 lbs right now about to go to 13.5. My BPFSL is unknown as i broke my ruler sitting on it as someone tried to walk in on me while measuring. haa.. If my measurements are same by April 29, ill change my plan completely. Maybe switch to girth or Extend only.
 
Nolove;692980 said:
Still doing 40mins a day hanging adding .5lbs every 2 weeks. Im at 13 lbs right now about to go to 13.5. My BPFSL is unknown as i broke my ruler sitting on it as someone tried to walk in on me while measuring. haa.. If my measurements are same by April 29, ill change my plan completely. Maybe switch to girth or Extend only.

Get yourself another ruler and expect to see gains! If you believe it and your mind is in the right place it will happen.
 
Measurements as of 5-01-2016
BPFSL- 9 1/16th inches or 23.01 cms. Broke the 23 cm mark finally. (as of February it was between 22 and 22.5 cmn)
BPEL- 8inches
NBPEL- 7.25
MSEG-5.5
BEG- no measurements, but it seems to have increased since its hugging my [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]extender[/words] base now(no pubs either).

I would like to confirm my erect measurements again. I also seen my erections going up again since reintroducing kegels. Im stiill afraid my test levels are low because erections and libido seems low. Will take a light workout for the new few days and up my fats.
 
Nolove;693703 said:
Measurements as of 5-01-2016
BPFSL- 9 1/16th inches or 23.01 cms. Broke the 23 cm mark finally. (as of February it was between 22 and 22.5 cmn)
BPEL- 8inches
NBPEL- 7.25
MSEG-5.5
BEG- no measurements, but it seems to have increased since its hugging my [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]extender[/words] base now(no pubs either).

I would like to confirm my erect measurements again. I also seen my erections going up again since reintroducing kegels. Im stiill afraid my test levels are low because erections and libido seems low. Will take a light workout for the new few days and up my fats.

It must feel awesome to hit that milestone that you so desired! Excellent work and gains well deserved!
 
Been deconditioning from hanging for 2 weeks and extending 3 hours a day at high tension with bundle stretching ....with that said, i lost 1/18th an inch in bpfsl and everything else is about the same.. Going to get back into hanging thursday or friday starting at 10 lbs and every week go up a pound.
will try and hour a day with extending but well see how the first week goes.
 
Nolove;697095 said:
Been deconditioning from hanging for 2 weeks and extending 3 hours a day at high tension with bundle stretching ....with that said, i lost 1/18th an inch in bpfsl and everything else is about the same.. Going to get back into hanging thursday or friday starting at 10 lbs and every week go up a pound.
will try and hour a day with extending but well see how the first week goes.

Loosing flaccid bone-pressed length is very uncommon. Why do you think this happened? I sometimes see men lose gains that have not been cemented yet but this really applies to erect length and erect girth gains. I hope you find the answer and you can break this plateau.
 
To be honest, for a good 2 weeks ive been where i stopped around 9 3/16 & 9 1/4. This week before Thursday its just slowly creeping down. My BPEL is also the same at 8 too . Might have just been never cemented. I ll measure again July first and hope its going up. Plan is 1lb per week added to hanging, different angel per day, 3-1 split. Hoping to get an hour a day, but when I dont ill add at least 3/4 hours of extending.

Thus far, i did 2 days of hanging @ 12.5 lbs for 40 mins total with 2 hours of extending and already sore as hell. Today Ill do the same . For days i feel very conditioned ill add a [words=https://officialhydromaxpump.com/?uid=6&oid=2&affid=98]bm[/words] sessions of 15 mins, 10 mins of clamping.
 
Most likely just not cemented, it will come back immediately upon training again.
 
shortdick;697711 said:
Going for that extra half an inch..Is a good way to make sure things are going to be great!!:)

When does the next half inch stop though? :)
 
Im back. lol
from june- july it was on and off with hanging and extending with some pumping. Started again in August hanging started from 10 and worked up to my last weight 12.5 lbs. September been at 14 now im at 16.5lbs. 3x20mins some days 4/5 sets with extending after hanging. Less pumping to ensure edema doesn't screw my hanging sets the following 2 days.

Started at 8.07 inches BPFSL now im at around 9.25 for the past week and after today's workout at around 9.3125(9 5/16th).
I feel soreness when i stretch down almost every day all day so i believe i worked to a weight that actually deforms my ligs so extra sets might be needed to continually hit creep.
My BPEL/NBPEL is everywhere. Days im at 8BPEL and 7.25 NBPEL and some days i can manage to hit 7.5 NBPEL and 8.25 BPEL.

Hanging goals will be to hit .5lbs per week rather than 1lbs per week. On fresh days ill add drop set with starting weight of an additional 1lb then drop to ensure creep.

Goal is still to hit 8nbpel before i try and get my girth to 6 inches. If i can manage to get to
 
Nolove;712887 said:
Im back. lol
from june- july it was on and off with hanging and extending with some pumping. Started again in August hanging started from 10 and worked up to my last weight 12.5 lbs. September been at 14 now im at 16.5lbs. 3x20mins some days 4/5 sets with extending after hanging. Less pumping to ensure edema doesn't screw my hanging sets the following 2 days.

Started at 8.07 inches BPFSL now im at around 9.25 for the past week and after today's workout at around 9.3125(9 5/16th).
I feel soreness when i stretch down almost every day all day so i believe i worked to a weight that actually deforms my ligs so extra sets might be needed to continually hit creep.
My BPEL/NBPEL is everywhere. Days im at 8BPEL and 7.25 NBPEL and some days i can manage to hit 7.5 NBPEL and 8.25 BPEL.

Hanging goals will be to hit .5lbs per week rather than 1lbs per week. On fresh days ill add drop set with starting weight of an additional 1lb then drop to ensure creep.

Goal is still to hit 8nbpel before i try and get my girth to 6 inches. If i can manage to get to

Damn dude nice gains. Good luck on girth goals!
 
Nolove;712887 said:
Im back. lol
from june- july it was on and off with hanging and extending with some pumping. Started again in August hanging started from 10 and worked up to my last weight 12.5 lbs. September been at 14 now im at 16.5lbs. 3x20mins some days 4/5 sets with extending after hanging. Less pumping to ensure edema doesn't screw my hanging sets the following 2 days.

Started at 8.07 inches BPFSL now im at around 9.25 for the past week and after today's workout at around 9.3125(9 5/16th).
I feel soreness when i stretch down almost every day all day so i believe i worked to a weight that actually deforms my ligs so extra sets might be needed to continually hit creep.
My BPEL/NBPEL is everywhere. Days im at 8BPEL and 7.25 NBPEL and some days i can manage to hit 7.5 NBPEL and 8.25 BPEL.

Hanging goals will be to hit .5lbs per week rather than 1lbs per week. On fresh days ill add drop set with starting weight of an additional 1lb then drop to ensure creep.

Goal is still to hit 8nbpel before i try and get my girth to 6 inches. If i can manage to get to

Damn dude nice gains! I'm doing the same thing with my training in waiting to hit my length goal before I start working in girth, but now I think I may start doing light/moderate jelqing everyday in the evening or before bed just to keep my girth up. Also, it could help with length gains as well! I'm going to subscribe to this thread so I can keep up with your road to 8"!!
 
Nolove;712887 said:
Im back. lol
from june- july it was on and off with hanging and extending with some pumping. Started again in August hanging started from 10 and worked up to my last weight 12.5 lbs. September been at 14 now im at 16.5lbs. 3x20mins some days 4/5 sets with extending after hanging. Less pumping to ensure edema doesn't screw my hanging sets the following 2 days.

Started at 8.07 inches BPFSL now im at around 9.25 for the past week and after today's workout at around 9.3125(9 5/16th).
I feel soreness when i stretch down almost every day all day so i believe i worked to a weight that actually deforms my ligs so extra sets might be needed to continually hit creep.
My BPEL/NBPEL is everywhere. Days im at 8BPEL and 7.25 NBPEL and some days i can manage to hit 7.5 NBPEL and 8.25 BPEL.

Hanging goals will be to hit .5lbs per week rather than 1lbs per week. On fresh days ill add drop set with starting weight of an additional 1lb then drop to ensure creep.

Goal is still to hit 8nbpel before i try and get my girth to 6 inches. If i can manage to get to

Welcome back home my Brother! Long time!

I am very proud of you and the gains you have made. I am glad you are back to help inspire the Brotherhood.
 
doublelongdaddy;713168 said:
Welcome back home my Brother! Long time!

I am very proud of you and the gains you have made. I am glad you are back to help inspire the Brotherhood.

Thanks! If it was for your posts and every one else who attributed to PE I wouldnt be here .

eugine8plz;713154 said:
Damn dude nice gains! I'm doing the same thing with my training in waiting to hit my length goal before I start working in girth, but now I think I may start doing light/moderate jelqing everyday in the evening or before bed just to keep my girth up. Also, it could help with length gains as well! I'm going to subscribe to this thread so I can keep up with your road to 8"!!

When i was extending only, i would pump/clamp maybe 2/3 days a week, however, when i do any girth work i get good expansion that lasts a day or two and screws up my hanging sessions. Its normal skin pinching, but i also get blisters so thats why i stopped. I should so more but ill test again soon.

Just keep going with your program and add volume every week or two . Well get there sooner or later lol.
 
took the 5th off.
6th i did 2x20 mins hanging in the am, 3x20 at night 30 mins extending after both sessions
7th i did 3x20 mins hanging with 30 mins post extending . Dick feels sore. retraction if no wrap on, and lower EQ. Might back off weight tonight and add an extra hour or two extending prior to hanging.
so instead of the usual 16.5lbs ill do 16/15 lbs.

Been doing alot of strength training, might be my body itself, however, fighting for every CM i can gain!
Wednesday I will attempt to pump after hanging and see how it goes. No clamping just my modified cockring all night .
 
Nolove;713298 said:
Thanks! If it was for your posts and every one else who attributed to PE I wouldnt be here .

Wow, thank you for that compliment!
 
No problem , just stating the hidden truth.

so yesterday felt good hanging, didnt get to extend much. EQ is back up after edging a little and doing base stretching while erect.

Not pumping as i thought tonight. Still curious to see if ill max out my [words=https://officialhydromaxpump.com/?uid=6&oid=2&affid=98]bathmate[/words] with new length though.
 
LOL, so i was about to start hanging and had to run errands................like literally 1 mins after i attached everything. So im just going to extend until i got to bed now that im back
 
So, Last night i did 3x20 hanging @ 17.5 lbs. New jump in weight just to stress my hanger and how much it can max and my ligs of coruse.
After warming up this will be my new starting weight. Ill drop down in weight if needed be. I believe the idea is to stress the ligs as much as i can so i can get more sessions with creep.
Been reading more creep in science journals. Although i only hand for an hour, i believe an increase in weight more than normal can influence the calculation in time under tension.
Might have to find some privacy so archive at least another session for hanging.


Also so add in, at this weight, BTC feels intense. Not a pain feel, but a stress in ligs feel. Once stop you feel a good stretch as in any type of stretch on a muscle. Even today when i stretch downwards i feel a sore muscle tension in base. althought ive been doing manly downward/btc angles my tug back in the 12 o'clock angel is almost gone.
 
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last night session was tough. went from 17.5lbs for the first session to 16 lbs for the last Very fatigued. Did 30 mins hanging this am as i might go out to watch ufc205 tonight and might end up not hanging. Was also tought as 16 lbs aswell 2x15 mins sessions with extending for 30 mins
 
I know most people read [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]extender[/words] should be on for 8 hours however, look at this.

The surgical treatments, the researchers found, were dangerous and had “unacceptably high rate of complications.” But among the nonsurgical methods, at least one appeared to help grow a man’s member: the “traction method,” in which a penile [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]extender[/words] stretched the phallus daily, resulted in average growth of 0.7 in., or 1.8 cm, of the flaccid penis in one study. In another study of the same method, men reported an average increase of 0.9 in. (2.3 cm) in length while flaccid and 0.67 in. (1.7 cm) while erect.

These gains were hard-earned: in the first study, participants had to be in [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]traction[/words] for four to six hours each day for a total of four months, and in the second study, the daily treatment lasted for six months.

In another study of two erectile-dysfunction patients, researchers found that the use of penoscrotal rings, which fit around the scrotum and base of the penis, helped beef up size and maintain erection. But given the tiny sample size of the study, the results were inconclusive.

Reviewed data also suggested that a six-month regimen of daily penis pumping — using a pump to create a vacuum inside a cylinder to stretch the penis while painful, was not effective.No matter the procedure, penis girth remained unchanged.

in another science journal i found this

"Length can be added by division of the penile suspensory ligament that tethers the penis to the pubic arch. This sounds like a simple solution, but remember the ligament was there for a reason. Dividing it will allow the penis to fall away from the pubis, giving some length (a couple of centimetres), but at a loss of the normal “angle” at erection. Also, this does not lengthen the skin, and so the peripenile pubic skin is often pulled onto the shaft of the penis, resulting in pubic hair growing from the penile shaft."

always wondered why i lost my 12 oclock erection angel and alot of hair on my mid shaft on my penis since pe and this finally confirms all the talks i had over the years about my speculations that these are indeed signs of growth in someway or another.
 
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Nolove;714193 said:
I know most people read [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]extender[/words] should be on for 8 hours however, look at this.

The surgical treatments, the researchers found, were dangerous and had “unacceptably high rate of complications.” But among the nonsurgical methods, at least one appeared to help grow a man’s member: the “traction method,” in which a penile [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]extender[/words] stretched the phallus daily, resulted in average growth of 0.7 in., or 1.8 cm, of the flaccid penis in one study. In another study of the same method, men reported an average increase of 0.9 in. (2.3 cm) in length while flaccid and 0.67 in. (1.7 cm) while erect.

These gains were hard-earned: in the first study, participants had to be in [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]traction[/words] for four to six hours each day for a total of four months, and in the second study, the daily treatment lasted for six months.

In another study of two erectile-dysfunction patients, researchers found that the use of penoscrotal rings, which fit around the scrotum and base of the penis, helped beef up size and maintain erection. But given the tiny sample size of the study, the results were inconclusive.

Reviewed data also suggested that a six-month regimen of daily penis pumping — using a pump to create a vacuum inside a cylinder to stretch the penis while painful, was not effective.No matter the procedure, penis girth remained unchanged.

in another science journal i found this

"Length can be added by division of the penile suspensory ligament that tethers the penis to the pubic arch. This sounds like a simple solution, but remember the ligament was there for a reason. Dividing it will allow the penis to fall away from the pubis, giving some length (a couple of centimetres), but at a loss of the normal “angle” at erection. Also, this does not lengthen the skin, and so the peripenile pubic skin is often pulled onto the shaft of the penis, resulting in pubic hair growing from the penile shaft."

always wondered why i lost my 12 oclock erection angel and alot of hair on my mid shaft on my penis since pe and this finally confirms all the talks i had over the years about my speculations that these are indeed signs of growth in someway or another.

Great summary :)!

Got the sources?
 
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC548174/

the other one i lost the link sorry, but im sure the study they quoted was from this link
Non-invasive methods of penile lengthening: fact or fiction? - Oderda - 2010 - BJU International - Wiley Online Library

its a good read however im sure majority read it before.

Several surgical techniques have been perfected to obtain penile girth enlargement. Among conservative methods, it has been claimed that penile [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]extenders[/words] can increase penile circumference by 0.6–1 cm/month [22]. It is not clear why these devices should be effective in enhancing penile girth; it has been hypothesized that chronic [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]traction[/words] causes soft tissue cellular proliferation with tissue growth in a multiplanar fashion [19]. These findings, however, were not confirmed by a study by Gontero et al. [7], who found only negligible changes in penile girth after 6 months of [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]traction[/words] therapy. Nikoobakht et al. [16] did not find significant changes in proximal penile circumference, either, although a significant difference was found in glans penile circumference. It is interesting, however, that no girth decrease was reported with [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]traction[/words] therapy, as one would have instinctively thought.
 
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