(?)Harmonic's Revenge: Getting Ripped

~With some disconcertion.~ Okay...

I think I'm going to do the following: For the next three months I'm going to try to get the hang of things and get some habituation with the gym, eating healthfully and sleeping enough, and at the same time.

For the six months after that I'm going to focus on building up strength and a good base to cut down to. I'm probably going to increase my calories and carbs around these six months, while introducing a less 'simple' whey protien, I was thinking about getting Surge and Low Carb Grow to help add on some muscle. I may also invest in some Creatine, but I'm going to do research on it first, not only is it hella' expensive, but 2manly you seems ardently convinced that it's completly worthless, and since you know a hell of a lot more about this than I do, I'm not gonna' just run out and buy it.

Then in the final three months of the year I'm going to decrease my calorie and carbohydrate intake and introduce some fat burners into my diet. I think green tea the first month, Hot-Rox the second, then the third, if I'm not where I want to be, I might try that ECA stack that you suggested, 2manly. This, like the creatine, however, I'll research the hell out of (My parents trained me to be a hypochondriac, go figure.)

Then, with luck, one year from now I'll be at least *close* to the pictures that I put up a page ago. A couple of questions real quick:

Right now I'm training for strength, pretty much. Three sets of ten reps, or, as the gym showed me the other night, one set of ten reps, one set of eight and a half reps, then one set of six reps. Anyhow, as I get closer to my 'year' how should I train to avoid putting on any more mass, while preserving what I already have? Should I do more reps with lighter weight, or train less often, or just train differently? I've read all the threads about how newbies are scared that they'll look like Arnold if they start lifting, and I'm no different.

The second question is directed mostly to 9cy: T-Nation has a whole bunch of different ways to use Surge. The one I'm mostly familiar with is "Half a serving before your workout; half a serving during your workout; one serving directly after your workout; one serving an hour after your workout (I think)". Several questions, but easy ones: Did I miss any? What should I do with it on not weight training days? Assuming I'm doing weights three times a week, and yoga, pilates and balance ball once a week, and have one rest day, how many jugs of Surge would I need for a one month supply? I ask the last, entirely math based question, because I'm not sure if I missed anything, if I should use it on 'off' days or if the Yoga/Pilates/Balance Ball count as training days.

Thanks again, Gents!
-Harm-

harmonic169 said:

The second question is directed mostly to 9cy: T-Nation has a whole bunch of different ways to use Surge. The one I'm mostly familiar with is "Half a serving before your workout; half a serving during your workout; one serving directly after your workout; one serving an hour after your workout (I think)". Several questions, but easy ones: Did I miss any? What should I do with it on not weight training days? Assuming I'm doing weights three times a week, and yoga, pilates and balance ball once a week, and have one rest day, how many jugs of Surge would I need for a one month supply? I ask the last, entirely math based question, because I'm not sure if I missed anything, if I should use it on 'off' days or if the Yoga/Pilates/Balance Ball count as training days.

Thanks again, Gents!
-Harm-

Click to expand...

I think the most current recommendation is one serving right before and one serving an hour after. There's an article by Dave Barr called top 10 PWO myths or something that has some good info. I can't afford that much Surge so I use whey isolate and maltodextrin with some BCAAs for pre-workout. I get it from www.proteinfactory.com because it's very cheap.

I wouldn't worry about having a PWO shake when you're doing yoga or cardio or whatever.

Thanks, Cy!

Hey, guys, when this starts getting annoying let me know!

reps of ten and 8 is not aiming to build strenght...reps of 2,3,4,5 would be aiming to build strenght. but i do thin a rep range btw 6 and 8 would be best for what you want

~Nods and will adapt this work out routine.~ Thanks.

Well, I've been thinking about this a little bit since my last post, and I realized something that you and Cy both tried to point out to me: I need to get healthy. If I'm healthy and fit, then I have the rest of my life to sculpt my body however I like, correct? So I think that should be the first thing I focus on.

As far as my consideration of fit: According to the internet (In it's infinite wisdom. ) I should have a BathmateI between 18.5 and 24.9. That said, the BathmateI doesn't take into consideration muscle mass at all, so I could have an unhealthy BathmateI and 12% BF. So that's disconcerting. According to a variety of different formulas I should weigh between 167lbs and 189lbs, with an average of 177.5lbs, but that seems kind of skinny.

Anyhow, after a little looking around, it would seem that the best measure is BFP, which should be around 10.8% for me. This means that I have to lose 35.4lbs to get to my 'ideal.' Which I think is doable over the course of the next ten months. Your opinion?

As for the specific measurements I'm looking for, I can't really say. I'm not good at visualizing, and I can't apply the various formulae on the internet, since I don't know what my waist size *should* be. Makes things kinda' tough, huh? I found the 'Grecian Ideal' on the internet, which states that I should be:

Chest: 46" (+3.5")
Waist: 32" (-11.5")
Hips: 39" (-4.5")
Bicep: 17" (+1.5")
Forearm: 13.5" (+1.5")
Thigh: 24.5" (-1")
Calf: 16" (-1.5")
Neck: 17" (+1")

(The numbers in parantheses are what I need to gain or lose to reach those numbers.)

But I don't know how reasonable the above is.

Actually, I've been thinking about it: I mostly want to be better in bed, that means increased strength and stamina. (That would be high weight at low reps, and low weight at high reps, correct?) So I guess my new, equally vague goals would be:

Get to 10.8% BF
Lose 35.4lbs of *fat*.
Increase my strength
Increase my stamina

'Cause after I get there, I can cut and bulk to my heart's content, yes?

Love to hear your input,
-Harm-

Oh! A question I forgot to ask: What're the muscles that we use durring missionary sex? I think it's:

Holding the position:
Pectorals
Deltiods
Biceps
Flexor Carpi Ulnaris

Thrusting:
Abdominal
Latissimus Dorsi
Sacrospinalis (Erecter Spinae)

Then lesser muscles:
Glutes
Thighs
Obliques

So, what specifically is the muscle that starts burning when I've held the position too long? I think it's the deltoids, but I'm not entirely sure. 'Cause I'd love for sex to not hurt anymore.

-Harm-

Don't focus too much on BathmateI, it doesn't take muscle mass into account. It's basically a decent guideline for untrained people, but once you throw some muscle mass in there, it's not very applicable anymore. The Greek thing is nice, but isn't really all that feasible. Those measurements are attainable, but to go for all of them exactly? Too tedious. I tthink a good way would be to go by the mirror. If you like what you see, then good. If you don't, change whatever it is that you need to change.

Bah! I fucking hate this! It's the whole, a little bit of knowledge is a dangerous thing phenom. I read that I can gain muscle and lose fat. That's good. Then I read that to grow muscle I have to increase my caloric intake by 20% or so of my basil requirement, and that odds are I'll add a little bit of fat while I 'bulk'. Then I read that I should do lowcarb during the week and get all ketogenic, then high carb during the weekend and bah! Plus Cy, you're saying that I need to have something to cut down to, and 2manly you're saying not to worry, I'll build that muscle by going to the gym even if I am dieting and... so many 'and's.... Things are getting a bit confusing. There's so much bloody information out there and it's all presented so well and I don't have a B.A. in Exercise Physiology or Nutrition, much less the seemingly required PhD. So I'm getting out of this that to get down to 10.8% BF I need to reduce my calories and regulate my carbs, but to get muscle I have to increase my calories and carbs. It just seems like it's physically impossible to both lose fat and gain muscle without a bit of divine intervention, which is doubtful 'cause God and I had a spat in middle school and He hasn't spoken to me since.

Sorry, I had to vent; I'm getting a little bit frustrated with the lack of science behind this. (I know there's a science, I'll just be damned if I can see if! ) What was I going to ask...? I can't recall.

Oh yeah! Okay, so I'm trying to figure out where I really should be. 10.8% BF is a good goal, I think. It may take me more than just this year (Considering that I'm coming down from about 27%) but that's fine, it'll just keep me going into 2007.

Next: You're both right, I need to build some damn muscle. How do I go about finding out just how much I actually have, and how much I would actually need for it to show? 163lbs or so if me *isn't* fat, but that narrows it down to bones, organs, water, nutrients and muscle. So how to I go about finding out how much of this 163lbs is muscle?

Next: I'm guessing that 43-42-43 aren't very good measurements: Do you guys know of an online tool type thingie where I could say "Okay, let's see, chest: 46"... nope, too big... 43"... a little too small..." etc.? I doubt I'm explaning this well. Is there a way I can see what I *would* look like *if* I had those measurements?

Let's say, just for shits and giggles, that at 6' 2" tall, I have zero pounds of muscle. Not litterally, of course, but just enough muscle to walk and generally live, how much would I have to tack on to make them visible at my goal BFP?

How much muscle could I add on in my year if I really kicked my ass?

Cy: Girls really like the squat butt? 'Cause I want girls to like my butt.... Damn white, non-exsistant, Irish ass.

Okay, so high points:

• How much muscle should I aim to add this year to look defined?
• How much muscle should I aim to add this year to look medium/big?
• Is there a way, aside from my stunning imagination, to see how I would look with x number of inches added to body part X?
• What specifically can I do to improve my ability to hold myself up in missionary?
• What is the average air speed velocity of an unlaiden swallow?

I think that's it for now. I know this is getting obnoxious guys, but you're both really helping a lot, and I mean that. If nothing else you guys have helped me to get up off my ass and into the gym, and stop eating pizza twice a week, and that's a lot.

Thanks,
-Harm-

You're thinking too hard about it. Lift right, eat right. The end. It's that simple. I think it's John Berardi that talks about "paralysis of over-analysis" in bodybuilding. Don't think too hard about it, it's a very simple process.

And yes, girls like a good butt. Squats will give you a good butt. :D

Speaking of that, squats are also the best way for a girl to get a fantastic ass.

Sorry to hijack but this is appropriate to all of you that had something to say earlier. Since my last posting, I've followed the Atkins diet and began the HIT routine that I posted. Guess what? I'm now 249.5 lbs (+ 8 lbs) and ~ 7% BF (- 6%). ALL NATURAL and only ~ 95-100 grams of carbs a day. No lethargy and muscles could be fuller but nothing even close to being considered flat. So, I guess all of you are right. Atkins and HIT don't work.

Bionic said:

Sorry to hijack but this is appropriate to all of you that had something to say earlier. Since my last posting, I've followed the Atkins diet and began the HIT routine that I posted. Guess what? I'm now 249.5 lbs (+ 8 lbs) and ~ 7% BF (- 6%). ALL NATURAL and only ~ 95-100 grams of carbs a day. No lethargy and muscles could be fuller but nothing even close to being considered flat. So, I guess all of you are right. Atkins and HIT don't work.

Click to expand...

HIIT does work, Atkins don't cant wait for you to start eating some carbs after you get off atkins....kaboom! diet is not a phase its a life style, unless you plan to eat 100 grams of carbs your whole life....which eventually lower your metabolism...then it will stop working and you will start to gain. But hey to each thier own.

I have to clear up on what I just said above.

1.) I was originally wrong, HIIT does work.

2.) Atkins does not work. You will drop weight/fat (but mostly weight) just on the fact that you are restricting cal intake and most importantly Carb intake. The basic premise of losing fat is do something to shock your body, which atkins does. However, you'r body will adapt. The more cals and carbs you restrict the worse your body is going to react. Unless your popping crazy amounts of ECA stacks or thermogenics, your going to fell lethargic and your metabolism is going to be horrendous. and once you start to eat more cals and carbs again your gonna gain some weight back again.

3.) Weight loss is a life style, not a phase or a drop weight quick type of thing (which atkins is). If something is too restrictive..cough atkins cough...then you are going gain weight back possibly more then before. But hey if you say it worked for you then good, far be it for me to call you a liar.