Erect or Non-Erect Jelq for Length Gains?

[boohoohoo]

As the title says, I am interested in length and doing an only jelqing routine. Will I get more length jelqing erect or non-erect? Also, what rate of growth would you guys expect from a 7 days a week 20 minutes a day jelqing routine?

1/2 inch a year?
1 inch a year?
1.5 inches a year?
More? Less?

 

[Longth]

As the title says, I am interested in length and doing an only jelqing routine. Will I get more length jelqing erect or non-erect? Also, what rate of growth would you guys expect from a 7 days a week 20 minutes a day jelqing routine?

1/2 inch a year?
1 inch a year?
1.5 inches a year?
More? Less?

For length you want to stick with low erection jelqing. Higher levels are generally considered girth but I kinda feel like the 70-80% range is decent for both. With jelqs you have to be extremely consistent and refrain from days off entirely.

 

[acromegaly]

Both lol, like longth said it takes a lot of Jelqs to grow

 

[templnite]

Only jelqs damn that sounds like it'd take eons. Why don't you use [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/forum/showthread.php?64036-My-Best-Work-Ever-Penis-Enlargement-will-Be-Changed-Forever-gt-gt-Gain%20inches%20with%20SRT-Theory-and-Routine]srt[/words]?

 

[boohoohoo]

For length you want to stick with low erection jelqing. Higher levels are generally considered girth but I kinda feel like the 70-80% range is decent for both. With jelqs you have to be extremely consistent and refrain from days off entirely.

Definitely agreed on the point about days off. I took yesterday off after 3 or 4 days of straight jelqing and I could definitely feel that the progress has receded a bit.

My erection level was particularly low today, but I just love the feeling of doing near 100% erection level jelqs. I'll try to refrain from days off in the future and stick to lower erection levels if possible (although if I get too hard I'll just push through it).

Both lol, like longth said it takes a lot of Jelqs to grow

I honestly would not mind gaining .5 inches of length and a even .25 girth a year. My goals in the past were for 3 inches of length and 2 inches girth, but now I would be more than happy gaining 2- 2.5 inches over 4 years.

Only jelqs damn that sounds like it'd take eons. Why don't you use [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/forum/showthread.php?64036-My-Best-Work-Ever-Penis-Enlargement-will-Be-Changed-Forever-gt-gt-Gain%20inches%20with%20SRT-Theory-and-Routine]srt[/words]?

I want to try jelqing out to see if it works. I am currently doing 20 minutes once a day. If that will give me even .5 inches a year I'll be happy. In the past I used to hang multiple hours a day and although I gained something between .5-1 inch in about 6 months my erection quality went to shit. I also have decided I will not dedicate more than 1 hour a day at most to PE because there is a lot more going on in my life that I need to attend to.

That being said I have been getting morning wood again for the first time in a long time with jelqing and it is a minimum time commitment, so I am happy with it. I am even willing to go as long as an hour straight a day of jelqing if necessary, but I will only look to do that after a six month trial period of 20 minutes a day.

 

[kyomoto]

Jelqing flaccid= length gains
Some guy from PEgym said he did it for 2 years and gained like 2 inches from flaccid jelqing and different forms of jelqing.

 

[LONGERDICK7+]

Jelqing flaccid= length gains
Some guy from PEgym said he did it for 2 years and gained like 2 inches from flaccid jelqing and different forms of jelqing.

flaccid gains=erect gains lets say a 7 inches flaccid can turn into a 7+erect penis

 

[ChilDsh]

As the title says, I am interested in length and doing an only jelqing routine. Will I get more length jelqing erect or non-erect? Also, what rate of growth would you guys expect from a 7 days a week 20 minutes a day jelqing routine?

1/2 inch a year?
1 inch a year?
1.5 inches a year?
More? Less?

Meh,i could write 5 pages about this subject,but imo a jelqing only routine will work only on a newbie.I see you're a member since 2011 so you've done PE for some time,i doubt 20 min of jelqing will give you any results.If you're dick is used to higher intensity , you're just wasting your time with jelqing.

You could give it a try i guess,but you will see slow and not-that-good gains.Something like the [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/forum/penis-enlargement-newbie-forum/1597-dlds-first-routine-i-gained-2-inches-with-this-routine-full-tutorial.html]newbie routine[/words] for exemple,it's 10x better than any jelq only routine.

But if you really want to focus on length doing jelqing,jelq flaccid because you're basically lightly stretching your dick.When your dick is erect it's full of blood so you will work girth the most.But as i said,if you're dick is used to a harder stretch,the flaccid stretch strength will not be enough for significant gains.

 

[DLD]

Jelqing only for length is a poor choice because it will take a great deal of time to bring gains, you will gain in girth but only slightly in length. Best to go with a pure length workout. Use the stretching routine outlined in [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/forum/showthread.php?64036-My-Best-Work-Ever-Penis-Enlargement-will-Be-Changed-Forever-gt-gt-Gain%20inches%20with%20SRT-Theory-and-Routine]SRT[/words], this will be the fastest route. Also, using the [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/forum/penis-enlargement-newbie-forum/1597-dlds-first-routine-i-gained-2-inches-with-this-routine-full-tutorial.html]newbie routine[/words] is not a bad idea as those stretches cover every area needed to see length gains. I would look to combine the knowledge of [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/forum/showthread.php?64036-My-Best-Work-Ever-Penis-Enlargement-will-Be-Changed-Forever-gt-gt-Gain%20inches%20with%20SRT-Theory-and-Routine]SRT[/words] with the simplicity of the [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/forum/penis-enlargement-newbie-forum/1597-dlds-first-routine-i-gained-2-inches-with-this-routine-full-tutorial.html]Newbie Routine[/words].

 

[boohoohoo]

I do agree that a jelqing only routine is a slow route to gains, but I like it and want to stick with it for the following reasons:

1. I do not mind growing slowly, as my goal is only to gain .5 inches of length a year at a minimum. As long as I gain that much I will be happy.
2. I haven't done any PE in about 5 months and my penis has reverted back to it's original size, so at this point I feel that I am deconditioned enough to make gains with this routine.
3. It is convenient and doesn't require much time. I can get my whole routine from start to finish done in 30 minutes, and I can basically do it anywhere as long as I have some vaseline.
4. I truly believe now after having done about a week of jelqing that it is the best PE method for [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]penis health[/words]. My erections, although much less frequent than when I was younger, are now rock hard and I finally have morning wood again. When I was hanging at the very end of my time doing so I got to the point that I couldn't even hold a 100 % erection for more than 10 seconds.
5. It works both length and girth. Although I am mainly interested in gaining 2 or more inches in length, I wouldn't mind gaining girth as well.

There are other reasons as well, but for now I am just going to stick to this jelqing only routine and reevaluate in 6 months. If I gain even .5 inches in that time I will stay committed. If not maybe I'll switch to hanging plus jelqing or something else.

 

[templnite]

Well you are right that jelqs are one exercise you should never forego

 

[ChilDsh]

I do agree that a jelqing only routine is a slow route to gains, but I like it and want to stick with it for the following reasons:

1. I do not mind growing slowly, as my goal is only to gain .5 inches of length a year at a minimum. As long as I gain that much I will be happy.
2. I haven't done any PE in about 5 months and my penis has reverted back to it's original size, so at this point I feel that I am deconditioned enough to make gains with this routine.
3. It is convenient and doesn't require much time. I can get my whole routine from start to finish done in 30 minutes, and I can basically do it anywhere as long as I have some vaseline.
4. I truly believe now after having done about a week of jelqing that it is the best PE method for [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]penis health[/words]. My erections, although much less frequent than when I was younger, are now rock hard and I finally have morning wood again. When I was hanging at the very end of my time doing so I got to the point that I couldn't even hold a 100 % erection for more than 10 seconds.
5. It works both length and girth. Although I am mainly interested in gaining 2 or more inches in length, I wouldn't mind gaining girth as well.

There are other reasons as well, but for now I am just going to stick to this jelqing only routine and reevaluate in 6 months. If I gain even .5 inches in that time I will stay committed. If not maybe I'll switch to hanging plus jelqing or something else.

Yeah jelqing only routine is decent,nowhere near something like the [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/forum/penis-enlargement-newbie-forum/1597-dlds-first-routine-i-gained-2-inches-with-this-routine-full-tutorial.html]newbie routine[/words],but if you like it,you can make it work.But prepare yourself,you will need patience. rofl

 

[Longth]

Yeah jelqing only routine is decent,nowhere near something like the [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/forum/penis-enlargement-newbie-forum/1597-dlds-first-routine-i-gained-2-inches-with-this-routine-full-tutorial.html]newbie routine[/words],but if you like it,you can make it work.But prepare yourself,you will need patience. rofl

I'd say at least throw in bundles before jelqs. Even better bundles and [words=https://officialhydromaxpump.com/?uid=6&oid=2&affid=98]bathmate[/words]. Better still regular bundles and jelqs to fatigue for [words=https://officialhydromaxpump.com/?uid=6&oid=2&affid=98]bathmate[/words] and jelqs with a ring.

Would add like 30 minutes a day but what a way to use 30 minutes. I'm going to do something like that for a while when all the heavy lifting is done for cementing and minor gains.

If you're going to jelq you should at least try to make them a more intense thing. They're easy enough to do where throwing in a trick or two should be pretty easy.

 

[DLD]

I did not mean forego jelqs because they were a poor exercise, only because they are mainly a girth exercise. After reading what men have wrote I agree that Jelqing should be included to a certain degree even when going for length exclusively because it keep the penis in good shape and healthy. Sorry I missed that point.

 

[kyomoto]

Yeah jelqing only routine is decent,nowhere near something like the [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/forum/penis-enlargement-newbie-forum/1597-dlds-first-routine-i-gained-2-inches-with-this-routine-full-tutorial.html]newbie routine[/words],but if you like it,you can make it work.But prepare yourself,you will need patience. rofl

He did say he's in no rush and doesn't mind taking long

flaccid gains=erect gains lets say a 7 inches flaccid can turn into a 7+erect penis

Yes.

 

[boohoohoo]

I have only jelqed for about a week now and my overall BPEL has increased from 7.125 to 7.25. While that may be just because of increased EQ, I still believe decent gains can be made from only jelqing.

I'm considering either adding one set of 20 minutes of hanging per the hardcore hanging method or else 3 hours of [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]SG[/words] use. I still haven't decided yet, but based on my belief a hanging plus jelqing routine is the best method for the quickest length gains. Any thoughts guys?

 

[kyomoto]

I have only jelqed for about a week now and my overall BPEL has increased from 7.125 to 7.25. While that may be just because of increased EQ, I still believe decent gains can be made from only jelqing.

I'm considering either adding one set of 20 minutes of hanging per the hardcore hanging method or else 3 hours of [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]SG[/words] use. I still haven't decided yet, but based on my belief a hanging plus jelqing routine is the best method for the quickest length gains. Any thoughts guys?

I say just do it you know? But I would prefer hanging instead of the [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]SG[/words] simply because hanging is more intense.

 

[Longth]

I have only jelqed for about a week now and my overall BPEL has increased from 7.125 to 7.25. While that may be just because of increased EQ, I still believe decent gains can be made from only jelqing.

I'm considering either adding one set of 20 minutes of hanging per the hardcore hanging method or else 3 hours of [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]SG[/words] use. I still haven't decided yet, but based on my belief a hanging plus jelqing routine is the best method for the quickest length gains. Any thoughts guys?

All of it.

If jelqing and hanging have worked for you it wouldn't even make sense to not use them again. And adding the [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]sg[/words] after should make things work a bit faster so far as gains go. If it were for me it's both 100%.

 

[kyomoto]

All of it.

If jelqing and hanging have worked for you it wouldn't even make sense to not use them again. And adding the [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]sg[/words] after should make things work a bit faster so far as gains go. If it were for me it's both 100%.

That's true. Just hang, jelq, then use the [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]SG[/words] the rest of the day.

 

[boohoohoo]

I would love to do all of that and gain really quickly, but I just don't have the time. If I use either the [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]SG[/words] or hanging, it has to be one or the other. Ideally I would just jelq and gain at the rate of .75 inches a year, but we will have to see.

I actually tried hanging tonight at 15 lbs and it was really intense so I had to lower the weight to 5 lbs which was too light. At this point I think I will just stick to jelqing and see how far it gets me. Who knows, I could be one of the lucky guys out there that gains 3 inches over a period of years just from jelqing. The issue with combining routines too early is that if I do both hanging and jelqing I won't ever truly know which, or if both, caused the gains. It could be that all the gains came from one or the other and the other one was just a waste of time.

I'm really tired of looking at my small dick, but I can't be the same guy as in the past where I dedicate too much time to it and neglect the rest of my life.

 

[kyomoto]

I would love to do all of that and gain really quickly, but I just don't have the time. If I use either the [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]SG[/words] or hanging, it has to be one or the other. Ideally I would just jelq and gain at the rate of .75 inches a year, but we will have to see.

I actually tried hanging tonight at 15 lbs and it was really intense so I had to lower the weight to 5 lbs which was too light. At this point I think I will just stick to jelqing and see how far it gets me. Who knows, I could be one of the lucky guys out there that gains 3 inches over a period of years just from jelqing. The issue with combining routines too early is that if I do both hanging and jelqing I won't ever truly know which, or if both, caused the gains. It could be that all the gains came from one or the other and the other one was just a waste of time.

I'm really tired of looking at my small dick, but I can't be the same guy as in the past where I dedicate too much time to it and neglect the rest of my life.

Ah mk. Well since time is limited i suggest hanging because you can always up the intensity

 

[Longth]

I would love to do all of that and gain really quickly, but I just don't have the time. If I use either the [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]SG[/words] or hanging, it has to be one or the other. Ideally I would just jelq and gain at the rate of .75 inches a year, but we will have to see.

I actually tried hanging tonight at 15 lbs and it was really intense so I had to lower the weight to 5 lbs which was too light. At this point I think I will just stick to jelqing and see how far it gets me. Who knows, I could be one of the lucky guys out there that gains 3 inches over a period of years just from jelqing. The issue with combining routines too early is that if I do both hanging and jelqing I won't ever truly know which, or if both, caused the gains. It could be that all the gains came from one or the other and the other one was just a waste of time.

I'm really tired of looking at my small dick, but I can't be the same guy as in the past where I dedicate too much time to it and neglect the rest of my life.

If you can't do all of it then you need to do what's been tested and successful for you in the past 100%. Maybe just use the [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]sg[/words] as a complimentary thing when you have the time.

 

[ChilDsh]

I have only jelqed for about a week now and my overall BPEL has increased from 7.125 to 7.25. While that may be just because of increased EQ, I still believe decent gains can be made from only jelqing.

I'm considering either adding one set of 20 minutes of hanging per the hardcore hanging method or else 3 hours of [words=https://shop.mattersofsize.com/products/sizegenetics-penis-extender]SG[/words] use. I still haven't decided yet, but based on my belief a hanging plus jelqing routine is the best method for the quickest length gains. Any thoughts guys?

The quickest way to gain length is to keep your dick elongated after a length workout aka [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/forum/showthread.php?64036-My-Best-Work-Ever-Penis-Enlargement-will-Be-Changed-Forever-gt-gt-Gain%20inches%20with%20SRT-Theory-and-Routine]SRT[/words] . Jelqing + hanging sounds good.Adding hanging to your routine will speed up the process of gains.Just make sure you don't wear tight underwear or something like this,keep your dick as elongated as possible and i can see bigish gains coming your way with that routine,but it's gonna take time.

 

[boohoohoo]

I've decided to hang one set a day for 30 minutes at the highest weight that I can handle. As Longth mentioned it is always a good idea to do something that has led to gains in the past, and that routine got me over 8 inches about a year ago (currently back down to 7.25). I'll continue to hang for as long as I reasonably can, and if I ever have to stop I'll transition into doing jelqs to either see if I can continue to grow or else to maintain my hanging gains.

 

[kyomoto]

I've decided to hang one set a day for 30 minutes at the highest weight that I can handle. As Longth mentioned it is always a good idea to do something that has led to gains in the past, and that routine got me over 8 inches about a year ago (currently back down to 7.25). I'll continue to hang for as long as I reasonably can, and if I ever have to stop I'll transition into doing jelqs to either see if I can continue to grow or else to maintain my hanging gains.

Sounds good dude. Let us know your progress

 

[DLD]

I've decided to hang one set a day for 30 minutes at the highest weight that I can handle. As Longth mentioned it is always a good idea to do something that has led to gains in the past, and that routine got me over 8 inches about a year ago (currently back down to 7.25). I'll continue to hang for as long as I reasonably can, and if I ever have to stop I'll transition into doing jelqs to either see if I can continue to grow or else to maintain my hanging gains.

Just do not forget to get your Bundled Stretches in before you train.

 

[Longth]

I've decided to hang one set a day for 30 minutes at the highest weight that I can handle. As Longth mentioned it is always a good idea to do something that has led to gains in the past, and that routine got me over 8 inches about a year ago (currently back down to 7.25). I'll continue to hang for as long as I reasonably can, and if I ever have to stop I'll transition into doing jelqs to either see if I can continue to grow or else to maintain my hanging gains.

Why did you not cementing process...

That's lot of faded glory man. You have a plan to cement the bastard this time?

 

[boohoohoo]

Why did you not cementing process...

That's lot of faded glory man. You have a plan to cement the bastard this time?

The reason I didn't cement is because my EQ went to shit so I decided to stop PE altogether to let it heal. Last time I only did hanging for about 7 months, and I guess that was not enough to cement. This time I intend to hang for at least 3 years if I am able to have the privacy to do so for that long. Also once I stop hanging I will transition into a 30 minute jelq routine for the rest of my life, so hopefully even if my gains aren't cemented for whatever reason I will still keep them through jelqing.

 

[Longth]

The reason I didn't cement is because my EQ went to shit so I decided to stop PE altogether to let it heal. Last time I only did hanging for about 7 months, and I guess that was not enough to cement. This time I intend to hang for at least 3 years if I am able to have the privacy to do so for that long. Also once I stop hanging I will transition into a 30 minute jelq routine for the rest of my life, so hopefully even if my gains aren't cemented for whatever reason I will still keep them through jelqing.

Pretty sure you can gain slowly for life that way. Just don't skip the kegels and you will have the best dick in the convalescent home.

 

[DLD]

Pretty sure you can gain slowly for life that way. Just don't skip the kegels and you will have the best dick in the convalescent home.

I think if men would focus less on time and more on the goal they will get there so much faster. Time will go by whether you train or not and after this time passes and you have not worked, you will be in the same place you are today. But, if you take each day as a new day and put your all into it, time will go by and you will be gaining all the while.

 

[kyomoto]

I think if men would focus less on time and more on the goal they will get there so much faster. Time will go by whether you train or not and after this time passes and you have not worked, you will be in the same place you are today. But, if you take each day as a new day and put your all into it, time will go by and you will be gaining all the while.

You tell'em DLD. Time is of irrelevance. It is the focus on a task you must have.

 

[Longth]

You tell'em DLD. Time is of irrelevance. It is the focus on a task you must have.

I guess there's truth in the going slow and steady being a better approach overall. Going for speed is grueling and then you have to cement the gains anyway. I just want to make the gains and just head into a year of maintenance and kegel training as a part of a fitness routine as a norm. It's not infeasible to think I'd make nice gains with a year of [words=https://officialhydromaxpump.com/?uid=6&oid=2&affid=98]bathmate[/words] and jelqs either, but a heavy routine gives you that gratifying huge expansion and makes me more hopeful than a slow going easy routine.

 

[DLD]

You tell'em DLD. Time is of irrelevance. It is the focus on a task you must have.

If anyone is in this as a sprint they will make little difference in size, PE is a lifetime commitment. Someone who truly wants to gain will need to dedicate himself completely to our practices. If time is the biggest thing you care about then you are going about this the wrong way, what needs to be most important is the daily commitment until the goal is reached. Today with the outline of [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/forum/showthread.php?64036-My-Best-Work-Ever-Penis-Enlargement-will-Be-Changed-Forever-gt-gt-Gain%20inches%20with%20SRT-Theory-and-Routine]SRT[/words] every man has the opportunity to make gains in the most comprehensive way. If a man dedicates himself to this as a permanent practice it will be easier to get through the time thing.

 

[kyomoto]

If anyone is in this as a sprint they will make little difference in size, PE is a lifetime commitment. Someone who truly wants to gain will need to dedicate himself completely to our practices. If time is the biggest thing you care about then you are going about this the wrong way, what needs to be most important is the daily commitment until the goal is reached. Today with the outline of [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/forum/showthread.php?64036-My-Best-Work-Ever-Penis-Enlargement-will-Be-Changed-Forever-gt-gt-Gain%20inches%20with%20SRT-Theory-and-Routine]SRT[/words] every man has the opportunity to make gains in the most comprehensive way. If a man dedicates himself to this as a permanent practice it will be easier to get through the time thing.

Perfectly said. PE is supposed to be unconscious of time and only a voluntary action.

 

[Perestroyka]

Newbie stretching routine, regular jelqs and [words=https://officialhydromaxpump.com/?uid=6&oid=2&affid=98]BM[/words] for 15 minutes should do the trick, try that bro, if you're willing to give a YEAR by hour a day practicing, you should do this, not complicated, you need hour straight and you cover both length and girth

 

[DLD]

Perfectly said. PE is supposed to be unconscious of time and only a voluntary action.

Time is the biggest lie ever told!

 

[LONGERDICK7+]

Time is the biggest lie ever told!

How so? why time is a lie,once the time barrier gets broken men can set himself free...time can be relative but how relative can time be??

Men invented time..

 

[Mlathem]

Hey Dld, Michael here. I Purchased my [words=http://www.mattersofsize.com/join-now.html]Mos[/words] membership site got my username and password, its great btw! I was wondering though, is it possible to change the password to something you can more easily remember?

 

[Longth]

Time is not a matter of opinion.

At this point relativity is.

 

[LONGERDICK7+]

relativity?

 

[Longth]

relativity?

Stupid Einstein with his paradigm altering understanding of how space and time work.

I just can't get behind relativity. Universe doesn't make sense like that, and it's kind of a law of physics that the universe ultimately makes sense. He was just obsessed with time travel.

So far off topic it's literally irrelevant

 

[LONGERDICK7+]

LOl he invented that term cause he had like a ton of free time he came up whit tons of theories most people dont understand n if they do understand them..no body really cares n yep its literally irrelevant!


we only care for the science of PE How to get larger,bigger, thicker, n getting massive gains!!!============================
============================
===========================================================================)))))))))))))

===========================================================================)))))))))))))

 

[templnite]

Yeah we all have to die so we can battle in the spiritual

 

[Longth]

Yeah we all have to die so we can battle in the spiritual

Dibs on invulnerability, teleportation, and impossible strength.

My spirit animal is inconceivable to mortal minds.

 

[LONGERDICK7+]

Yeah we all have to die so we can battle in the spiritual

PE on the other side just to share the gains whit beautiful fairies,hot witches,n female elves.

 

[templnite]

Ill take the Freddy Kruger glove, and the Nintendo power glove

 

[Longth]

Actually, I'll just take interdimensional travel. That way I can find a place I'm truly happy. And then when I'm bored of that I'll find a place where I'm truly miserable. And when I die, I'll find a place where I am still alive.

Interdimensional travel is broken

 

[templnite]

You wouldn't be yourself in that dimension it'd be some other dude who you compete with for most edging hours

 

[Longth]

Unless I go to a dimension where it's expected that I'd be arriving.

And I think it'd eventually be ruled out for myself to go to any dimension where I was less than my ideal size, at which point edging would be a waste. Especially with all the dimensions I'd be able to choose from where sex is imminent.

 

[templnite]

:/....that doesn't make sense, and now Mike's gonna be upset you guys hijacked this thread