Integrity

kong1971 · Jul 7, 2005

What is integrity?

Is it never being wrong? Never being a newbie? Always remaining skeptical and realistic and uncompromising?

I think much of your personal dislike for me stems from the mistakes I made when I first started posting here, skepdick. Although I did make mistakes in the past, I have come clean about them many, many times... made specific threads about them... apologized... I know when I was a fresh, new Penis Enlargementer, I did not measure the correct way. I know that when I started I was much heavier and in fact some 2 inches of length were obscured by fat pad. Since then I have accepted the correct way of measuring. I have corrected my claimed stats to 7.25 bp and 6.5 NBP. I have even lost weight and got my fatpad down to a more reasonable and acceptable 1 inch. Yet still you cling to your anger and sense of outrage. I'm not sure why. When someone apologizes to me, I generally accept it, but whatever gets you through the day.

I think AC has integrity. Even though he has come down on me hard quite often, at the end of the day he can lean back and smile and say, "Yeah, I know you're human and it's okay if you fucked up." Hey, he still lets me stick bananas in his ass, so you know he's gotta love me.

I think Kooky has integrity, because even though he is realistic, he has an open mind, and a helpful disposition.

I think I have integrity, too. Not because I never made a mistake or do not have faults, but because I have always admitted to them both.

If you can't get over it, then maybe you can quit nagging about it, because we've all heard how bad I am so many times it's even starting to bore me, and you know how I LOVE to talk about me!

goodbutnotgreat · Jul 7, 2005

Kong, your contributions on this thread seem to be kind of steering things towards a conflict between you and skepdick.

We're talking about the forum in general much more than specific individuals here. This isn't about "you and skepdick" or any other personal conflicts, so I would appreciate it if you would quit acting like the thread was personally addressing you. Feel free to discuss the issues - but we all know your perosnal history and feelings already, no need to repeat for the zillionth time here.

Lets have the posting on people's opinions of the issues raised at large. This isn't about one person against another, it's about the kind of conduct and standards that some people think would make a better forum.

kong1971 · Jul 7, 2005

Hmm, sorry if I hijacked that a little. I'll try not to henceforth. It's a personal flaw of mine to take things to heart.

I do realize what you guys are saying about this whole self-deception and glory-sizing issue, but I do not believe the answer to it is coming down on others in a negative or critical manner. I believe the issue can be taken up in a positive fashion, so that newbies are set straight and encouraged at the same time. If someone posts a picture that might not be clear, how about just saying, "Nice cock! How about a ruler shot?" instead of something like this, which seems somewhat confrontational to me: "I am certainly not doubting you, as I have seen your pics and you have a big cock. However, that is quite a deceptive angle and I honestly wouldn't be able to tell if you were 7 inches or 10 inches from it. How about a clear standing overhead shot with a ruler if you are going to claim a 9'er here on the forum?" Both basically say the same thing, but without the suggestion of the poster being deceptive.

That's all I mean when I talk about positivity and negativity.

Also, I think it is very arrogant for you guys to think you are the only ones who understand how this whole forum thing works. I would think most of us understand that some people might exaggerate their claims a little -- but is .25" really bad enough to get you guys all riled up like that? Heck, I know that if someone claims 8 inches, its probably more like 7.85", maybe 8" on a really, really good day. I also realize that a 7 inch cock with 1 inch of fatpad is really just 6 inches. We don't need to be enlightened. We ALL know it. We know what the difference between NBP and BP is. We know that girth at the base is generally larger than girth at the tip. What I don't get is why some of you need to make it a HUGE and HORRIBLE breach of honesty, when it is in fact kind of commonly understood.

You, swank, posted a very clear and fairly measured photo of your penis. However, you admitted that it was more a flaccid stretch shot than an actual erect photo. Point is, flaccid stretch is generally longer than actual erect. I know this. Several other guys probably know this, but no one came down on you because it's not a huge deal. No one cares if your BPFSL is 8 while your actual erection may vary between 7.5 to 8 depending on hardness. It's still a big fucking dick, and I know I am not going to lose any sleep worrying about how big your flaccid stretch is compared to an actual erect measurement.

Skepdick's photos were perhaps the best quality ruler shots I've seen here, but even he measured BP, and had a little fat there. Did anyone nail him to the wall for it? Nope. His small amount of pubic fat pad is just not really all that big a deal. Half an inch? Who cares? I thought it was way more impressive than anything I could show with my fat gut, but why feel the need to rub someone's nose in it?

The problem when it comes to trying to scientifically quantify the measurements of a soft and variable organ like the penis is that ALL penis measurements are somewhat approximate. It is, after all, an inflatable and stretchable little protrusion of blood and tissue. It's not actually solid, like bone.

We ALL know this. Most of us accept this.

Please don't make this out to be a personal attack of any kind. It's not. I am just sharing my opinion on this topic. My opinion is that you can't really nail down a definitive measurement on someone's penis because the very nature of our sexual organ prevents this. The best we can hope for is a reasonable approximate, and making a big issue out of it is kind of petty and suggests insecurity or arrogance to my mind. If you feel that there is a problem with integrity here, then continue to lead by example, as you both have been, but please stop the condescencion and criticism.

Anyway, I've made my points, so unless someone attacks me personally instead of my ideas, as some here are wont to do, I am going to make like AC and bow out of this debate.

goodbutnotgreat · Jul 8, 2005

Kong, I understand all that and there are some valid comments in there. Just one gripe, I never said my pictures were anything but flaccid, and my actual erection is more like 7.25", definately less than the photo. I've stated that before though.

Nobody is trying to be negative or bash on others with this thread - it's essentially just a real opinion. Some might not think it sounds so nice, but as they say, truth hurts. The indulgence of 'glory sizing' and support group atmosphere makes this forum less tolerable for people that are seriously interested in Penis Enlargement rather than just wasting time making up stuff about their dicks, and it seems some here on this site seem to prefer that kind of environment.

Also, I think I speak for others when I nobody cares about fudging .25" or whatever. According to the polls and such, there are some massive sizes hanging around, and many of the most prominent folks in Penis Enlargement refuse to verify their gains and size. It's the bodybuilding forum thing again. If you ran around one of those giving guys workout tips because supposedly you built up some massive 28" guns, eventually people are going to want to be sure the guy who seems to have figured it out is legit. There are a ton of guys on this site who claim a size that is in like the top 2% statistically, but so very little proof.

Lets hear from some more of you all on this . . . please address the original post if possible, that sums it all up pretty nicely.

koooky · Jul 8, 2005

I know I(we) aren't supposed to take this thread personally, but there are people who will. That being said, this is how I take it personally.

I recenlt made a thread where I claimed a decent gain. The only reason I made the thread was because I was at �other forum� and was going through the old size logs over there. I checked out lots of people from here as well as myself.

That led me to believe the gains I have now made after a very long time of doing almost everything in the realm of Penis Enlargement. I have always said that I am horrible at keeping logs and really tracking my progress. That still stands. The time frame I am talking about and the gains I have made are not going to be readily apparent when you are not tracking it. I am very confident now that I could post a pretty decent pic.

Here's the problem. What proof would there be of what size I was from 2-3 years ago?
A current pic only prooves current size, it does nothing at all to validate any GAIN CLAIMS. Which I think is what Skepdick is really after here. How to verify gains. I am sure there are guys who were born with 8inch dicks and could take really good pics. What if he CLAIMED he started out at 5 and it took him 5 years? Do you think he took a pic from 5 years ago?

Now....speaking from a not so personal point of view, I understand where Skep is coming from and I believed the same argument to be true concerning claims about FR. I would hate for some 16 year old kid to come in here and really fuck himself up forever because of what someone here advised for him to do or he was led to believe he is way below average is size so he does some 16 yearoldish stupid crap to try and make it bigger. Do we really need that as a group?

I think the best part of this forum is that there is a vast amount of knowledge and experience wrapped in here. There is also probably just as much bullshit and useless threads as well. The great thing is, we get to pick and choose what threads and sub forums we want to read and the threads(and users) we want to igore.

kook
3x3 square cock

Edit---
Swank, if your still up come to the chat room!

Skepdick · Jul 8, 2005

kong1971 said:
Hmm, sorry if I hijacked that a little. I'll try not to henceforth. It's a personal flaw of mine to take things to heart.

I do realize what you guys are saying about this whole self-deception and glory-sizing issue, but I do not believe the answer to it is coming down on others in a negative or critical manner. I believe the issue can be taken up in a positive fashion, so that newbies are set straight and encouraged at the same time. If someone posts a picture that might not be clear, how about just saying, "Nice cock! How about a ruler shot?" instead of something like this, which seems somewhat confrontational to me: "I am certainly not doubting you, as I have seen your pics and you have a big cock. However, that is quite a deceptive angle and I honestly wouldn't be able to tell if you were 7 inches or 10 inches from it. How about a clear standing overhead shot with a ruler if you are going to claim a 9'er here on the forum?" Both basically say the same thing, but without the suggestion of the poster being deceptive.

That's all I mean when I talk about positivity and negativity.

Also, I think it is very arrogant for you guys to think you are the only ones who understand how this whole forum thing works. I would think most of us understand that some people might exaggerate their claims a little -- but is .25" really bad enough to get you guys all riled up like that? Heck, I know that if someone claims 8 inches, its probably more like 7.85", maybe 8" on a really, really good day. I also realize that a 7 inch cock with 1 inch of fatpad is really just 6 inches. We don't need to be enlightened. We ALL know it. We know what the difference between NBP and BP is. We know that girth at the base is generally larger than girth at the tip. What I don't get is why some of you need to make it a HUGE and HORRIBLE breach of honesty, when it is in fact kind of commonly understood.

You, swank, posted a very clear and fairly measured photo of your penis. However, you admitted that it was more a flaccid stretch shot than an actual erect photo. Point is, flaccid stretch is generally longer than actual erect. I know this. Several other guys probably know this, but no one came down on you because it's not a huge deal. No one cares if your BPFSL is 8 while your actual erection may vary between 7.5 to 8 depending on hardness. It's still a big fucking dick, and I know I am not going to lose any sleep worrying about how big your flaccid stretch is compared to an actual erect measurement.

Skepdick's photos were perhaps the best quality ruler shots I've seen here, but even he measured BP, and had a little fat there. Did anyone nail him to the wall for it? Nope. His small amount of pubic fat pad is just not really all that big a deal. Half an inch? Who cares? I thought it was way more impressive than anything I could show with my fat gut, but why feel the need to rub someone's nose in it?

The problem when it comes to trying to scientifically quantify the measurements of a soft and variable organ like the penis is that ALL penis measurements are somewhat approximate. It is, after all, an inflatable and stretchable little protrusion of blood and tissue. It's not actually solid, like bone.

We ALL know this. Most of us accept this.

Please don't make this out to be a personal attack of any kind. It's not. I am just sharing my opinion on this topic. My opinion is that you can't really nail down a definitive measurement on someone's penis because the very nature of our sexual organ prevents this. The best we can hope for is a reasonable approximate, and making a big issue out of it is kind of petty and suggests insecurity or arrogance to my mind. If you feel that there is a problem with integrity here, then continue to lead by example, as you both have been, but please stop the condescencion and criticism.

Anyway, I've made my points, so unless someone attacks me personally instead of my ideas, as some here are wont to do, I am going to make like AC and bow out of this debate.

You bring some legitamate points to the table. Yes, the penis isn't totally rigid and erections can be larger or smaller based on a lot of factors including level or arousal, stress, whether or not the person has consumed any drugs such as caffeine or nicotene. However I am not talking about minute fluctuations in size on the .25 inch level of significance. Mine too fluctuates in size somewhat and that is why I hesitated to ever even post my size here.

However, many members are not just making errors rounding off and/or getting new measurements than differ by a fraction of an inch. I believe that many members here are off by an inch or two. Kong, you admitted that you were getting overzealous with your measuring and were claiming 8.25 for awhile. You did see the error in your ways and now report a more accurate measurement. Many are guilty of this. I remember there was a member named horsehung who claimed to have grown about 3-4 inches to his current size of 10.5 by 7.5. Naturally, he was hounded for a picture and when it finally came up I couldn't help but laugh. The guy was exagerating by 3-4 inches lengh and probably 1.5-2 in the girth! We never did get a clear measured picture but it was clear; the guy was full of shit!

Titleist · Jul 8, 2005

I don't post frequently, but I feel compelled to jump in on this topic.

I think the education process should start with the newbie's. People come to this site looking for "real" help with increasing their size. I hate the picture threads that start out with, "guess my size or how big is it?". We shouldn't guess at sizes. Picture posting should always have a few shots with rulers included. I was somewhat skeptical when I first started. I have have seen some personal gains through my own routine. I think when someone claims whatever size and there aren't pictures to validate change, it illigitimizes the whole forum.

If you're going to claim any size be it large or small, post ruler pictures in the accepted format. It's up to the vets here to help keep this forum a place where real change and help can be found.

Titleist

Chi · Jul 8, 2005

I can understand if some members are shy and don't want to post pictures. Other than that, I totally agree with Titleist.

Many newbies that come here are already very anxious and insecure about their size. Som even have big dicks already and after looking around, get more insecure and anxious.

The newbie forum can get a lot better if we can think of ways to improve it. I'm sure some of you have ideas on how to do this. I think it should be the most important section of a truly dedicated forum, but most members forget about it after they feel they are not newbies anymore.

Remember when you were a total newbie? There are lots of people feeling that way right now. Anyone can give back a little of what they have gotten from here.

And yeah we need more ruler pictures, this should be regarded as the only verifiable truth, and all assumptions based on them. It may not be the most representative thing, but better than what we have right now.

kong1971 · Jul 9, 2005

Skepdick said:
You bring some legitamate points to the table. Yes, the penis isn't totally rigid and erections can be larger or smaller based on a lot of factors including level or arousal, stress, whether or not the person has consumed any drugs such as caffeine or nicotene. However I am not talking about minute fluctuations in size on the .25 inch level of significance. Mine too fluctuates in size somewhat and that is why I hesitated to ever even post my size here.

However, many members are not just making errors rounding off and/or getting new measurements than differ by a fraction of an inch. I believe that many members here are off by an inch or two. Kong, you admitted that you were getting overzealous with your measuring and were claiming 8.25 for awhile. You did see the error in your ways and now report a more accurate measurement. Many are guilty of this. I remember there was a member named horsehung who claimed to have grown about 3-4 inches to his current size of 10.5 by 7.5. Naturally, he was hounded for a picture and when it finally came up I couldn't help but laugh. The guy was exagerating by 3-4 inches lengh and probably 1.5-2 in the girth! We never did get a clear measured picture but it was clear; the guy was full of shit!

Not as full of shit as you, Gandolf! :finger:

I really feel betrayed by you. As a newbie, you were my idol over at peforum. Next time anyone challenges my integrity, I'm gonna give them the big F.U.! See that title under my user name. Any of you sonsabitches wanna talk about honesty now, I suggest you look down the front of your own drawers first before trying to make the rest of us look like liars. Just like I said: Point a finger at someone else, there's three more pointing back at you.

goodbutnotgreat · Jul 9, 2005

Nobody has been pointing a finger at you Kong, these threads aren't about you, despite your renewed effort to make it as such.

Skepdick was banned for some personal shit with DLD. He recently posted crystal clear measurement pics, probablt the best and most comprehensive on the site, and he was also a financial contributor to this forum. He was a good and well-spoken poster, and he had a lot of interesting and smart things to say.

Just yesterday you were getting along really well with him and contributing to his threads and discussing things in a civil manner.

It's easy to take shots at somebody when they can't stick up for themselves isn't it? Frankly I feel like your conduct concerning this matter reflects pretty poorly on your character, but that's your prerogative.

I would humbly suggest, however, to stop with the multiple posts, concieved from personal bitterness, trashing a banned member that can't even speak to defend himself.

kong1971 · Jul 9, 2005

I hope you will understand my personal feelings concerning this and overlook my angry reaction. Gandolf was my newbie idol, as I said, way back when I first started posting on peforum. It was very shocking and hurtful when I discovered that skepdick, who often accused me of being a liar and a scam artist, turned out to be one and the same as my former Penis Enlargement idol. I apologize for losing my temper in the face of his hypocracy. I am, after all, only human. I said my peice. Now it's water under the bridge.

philadelph · Jul 9, 2005

Remember guys, its JUST a Penis Enlargement forum... Don't get your panties in a bunch. :D

thefranchise · Jul 11, 2005

WTF Skeptic was Gandolf all this time. Same one that deleted a bunch of threads?

REDZULU2003 · Jul 11, 2005

Its seems that Skepdick was indeed Gandolf, yes and he has also comeback as skepdick2 and hence banned again, very sad really.
Just goes to show, he had the issues all along and was venting his sad existince out on us.

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