How to convince a religious girl...

9cyclops9 said:

What I mean is, just because I haven't slept with my fiance yet doesn't mean that we won't have amazing sex when we get married, and I'd be willing to bet we'll be screwing like rabbits long after the couple that had sex often before marriage.

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I truly hope you will, but you just don't know for SURE.

9cyclops9 said:

Now, she may or may not decide to adhere to that verse.

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millionman said:

You honestly can't expect two completely different outlooks/philosophies to function together, because at some point the two will clash and cancel each other out, and leave only frustration anger and bitterness.

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That's when love comes into play...

AlloyCG said:

This thread has spiraled out of control. At least you guys aren't getting worked up over it =)

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True VERY true...

Honestly, I don't think you understand what it is that we are saying. Love as you see it is something that you feel. We are talking about love as a choice. Examply of this is God's love for us. It's never ending, it's always there, and we need not doubt it. The love you have described so far in your post says I need assurance of how you will perform and make me feel so that I can give you my love. God doesn't as us to do anything for His love, it's a free gift of grace give in the form of His one and only Son. Now what Cyclops is talking about is trusting in Him and knowing that God is watching over their relationship and keeping them for each other because they will have amazing and glorifying relations together, one that will be everything that they both desire, which follows along with Matthew 7:7 "Ask and it will be given, seek and you shall find. Knock and the door will be opened to you. For anyone who asks receives, he who seeks finds, and to him who knocks the door opened." At many points in my walk with Christ I have prayed for the woman I will spend the rest of my life with, and I know God will provide that in everyway. There is no doubt or unbelief, just knowing and trusting God. God won't let cyclops down, or anyone else for that matter, he holds up his end eternally.

I didnt read page 2 or last part of page 1 where I am sure it "got out of control" but...

That's when love comes into play...

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Dude no. I cant tell you how many times my pastor asked our congregation to pray for a lady or a man who's spouse was not Christian and they wanted to have kids, but were at controversy knowing even if they agreed to bring em up Christian the spouse would not be setting an example.

Also praying they will come to believe, and to pray for the relationship as it is falling apart.

ANYWAYS, the Bible says to not be "unequally yoked", meaning do not marry non-believers. If she believes the Bible says do not have premarital sex she should believe this one. No offense, but it wont work, and I am not here to doom you, just telling you how it has happened countless times.

And you can know the sex will be good. Oddly I can tell with my sister and the man she is going to marry, both who have remained abstinant all their lives and to each other. One of the biggest reasons for getting married besides they are madly in love and perfect for each other. You can tell the way they act.

For starters marriage is about compromise. You say you say you will not go to church with her, and she will not follow you athesist ways. Man I hate to bust your bubble but you are both in for a rude awakening. When companions agree on such basic issues marriage is tough. To disagree from the beginning .... man i can't even imagine that.

9cyclops9 said:

What's your point? Are religious people the only ones that are hypocrites? Everyone is a hypocrite, so what are you trying to say? Same with your "there are 100s of preachers" thing. There are thousands of men that would be willing to have sex with other men's wives, religious and not. So what's your point? The only point I can see in this statement is that there are men that would be willing to have sex with other men's wives. Sexual incompatibility has nothing to do with a lack of premarital sex.

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BIGTIME!
yeah,alot of other men could/would fuck your wife or girlfriend,but they arent using the bible and the word of god to get into the pants of a vunerable woman,and if you think this doesnt happen(ALOT!) then u are living in a fantasy world.i'm not sayin they all are,there are alot of good preachers(more good than bad) etc.but there are plenty of bad ones.my beef with the church is when they catch these slimeballs they just "ENCOURAGE" them to move to another parish.when doctors ,or other types that people place their faith in get caught doin this shit,THEY GET PROSECUTED"

9cyclops9 said:

What I mean is, just because I haven't slept with my fiance yet doesn't mean that we won't have amazing sex when we get married, and I'd be willing to bet we'll be screwing like rabbits long after the couple that had sex often before marriage.

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THERE ARE MANY COMBINATIONS THAT YOU CAN ROLL WITH DICE,MAYBE YOU WILL ROLL A 7,GOOD LUCK

Pharaoh said:

I agree 1000 %, couldn't have said it better!

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GOOD LUCK MAN,I HOPenis Enlargement THINGS WORK OUT FOR YA!

WNT2MORE said:

BIGTIME!
yeah,alot of other men could/would fuck your wife or girlfriend,but they arent using the bible and the word of god to get into the pants of a vunerable woman,and if you think this doesnt happen(ALOT!) then u are living in a fantasy world.i'm not sayin they all are,there are alot of good preachers(more good than bad) etc.but there are plenty of bad ones.my beef with the church is when they catch these slimeballs they just "ENCOURAGE" them to move to another parish.when doctors ,or other types that people place their faith in get caught doin this shit,THEY GET PROSECUTED"

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You're confusing Catholicism with Christianity. Catholicism is ONE BRANCH of Christianity, not the whole thing. Corruption like you speak of happens far more often in Catholicism than in Protestant denominations because Catholic priests aren't allowed to marry. Protestant pastors are. Catholic priests have bottled up sexual desires because they aren't permitted to release them. So they are much more likely to try to take advantage of someone in the situation you've described. Most protestant pastors have wives, so they have no suppressed sex drives screaming to get released.

But I'll say it again. There is corruption in EVERY group of people. Why do you look down on Christians so much for it, but when I mention that other people are the same you just blow it off? Why does it matter whether they use the word of God or if they use money, a position (screwing the boss for a promotion), or any other method? Is one way any more wrong than any other? Why do you look down on pastors who would take advantage of sexually frustrated women more than you look down on any other guy doing the same thing? And I think you're mistaken. Pastors and priests get prosecuted for this stuff too.

I have 100% confidence that we will be sexually compatible when we get married. Assume for a minute God exists. I don't know if you believe He does or not, but assume. Say you go to buy a new car and God tells you "WNT2MORE, you will love this car. This is a car that you can drive for the rest of your life and be happy about it." Don't you think you would trust him on that? Assuming that God is the all-knowing creator that I believe Him to be, I think you could take his advice and buy the car without a test drive.

Now. I believe 100% that my fiance is the person God has set aside for me to marry. I believe he is telling me "Cyclops, this girl is perfect for you. This is a girl you an spend the rest of your life with and be totally satisfied with her and never have to look anywhere else for satisfaction of any kind." I'll trust Him on that one, and I don't need a test drive.

millionman said:

At many points in my walk with Christ I have prayed for the woman I will spend the rest of my life with, and I know God will provide that in everyway. There is no doubt or unbelief, just knowing and trusting God. God won't let cyclops down, or anyone else for that matter, he holds up his end eternally.

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god never lets anybody down, right?
wasn't it you who wrote that there are higher divorce rates in church?

C-Guy said:

For starters marriage is about compromise. You say you say you will not go to church with her, and she will not follow you athesist ways. Man I hate to bust your bubble but you are both in for a rude awakening. When companions agree on such basic issues marriage is tough. To disagree from the beginning .... man i can't even imagine that.

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I don't know if I get your point. isn't the "no church-no atheist way-thing" a compromise?

anyway, have you ever thought of couples who share different believes? that CAN work out as well and that raises way more problems than a believer and a non-believer ever will encounter.

WNT2MORE said:

GOOD LUCK MAN,I HOPenis Enlargement THINGS WORK OUT FOR YA!

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Thanx bro!

I know I start writing off topic as well. anway, what I'd like to add to the divorce rate thing:

don't you think all couples (apart from certain examples) think that they found THE one? so how come the rate in church is higher?
I tell you why:
If you don't live together beforehand, if you don't have sex, than you just don't REALLY know the other person. you think you do, but you don't.
If you live a wordly life, you might have a couple of relationships before you get married. but this helps you to find out what you really want, what you are looking for in a girl. and you don't have these relationships because you want to have a few ones. no, every time you think that she's the one. but it might take you years to find out if you are compatible or not. So I think it's incredibly naive to marry a girl you couldn't really get to know. that can give you a rude awakening as well!
Some of you tell me about TRUE love and even question my love. how do you know? I take advise from a married man like kong, but not from someone who's never lived it.
I have already been engaged and I have seen how love can blossom and how love can fade. I know what love is man. We didn't break up because we had sex or lived together for some years. It simply took us 2 years (which were wonderful most of the time) to find out that we are incompatible. What if I had married her before? I'd be among the divorce rate myself. And believe me, I felt she was the one.

See this is the problem. You use reason and rationalize your decisions despite the fact that God's word which is infallible says Sex is to be saved for marriage. This is not a personal attack, I've been there myself. You say live together and figure it out, but see the problem with figuring it out is the damage that "figuring" it out causes to both parties. The reason the divorce rate in the church is so high stems from several things, mainly people going through relationships and "figuring" it out and ending up just wanting someone, someone to love, to care for etc. Christ talks about serving two masters. You will love one and hate the other, because you can not have two allegiances. Again this comes back to this discussion very quickly, you can't be a believer in the Savior and take little bits of what he says and then combine that with what the world says. For how can light and darkness exist in the same body??? A good number of people within the church are...shockingly not Christian. They play at church and go about doing the "religious" things that everyone seems to not really like or regard too highly. See as men we can not know a man's heart, but God says you will know my children by the fruit they bear. My biggest point in all of this Pharoah is when does faith come into play, when do we become part of something bigger than ourselves, and when does it stop being about me, me, me??? The biggest reason people deny who Christ was is not because he wasn't who he said he was, but because he requires too much, the perfect example is the rich young man. He persued Christ and said what must I do to follow you, Christ replied give away all of your belongings and follow me. He requires too much of us to lay down our lives to serve Him and to love others as He loved is extremely difficult. Love is all that is neccessary to survive, and by the Grace of God we have the Son and eternal life through Him.

Guys I have been a lurker for a while now. This thread has really gotten my interest. Pharaoh, you said you wanted some other christian veiws on this. A lot of what has been said already goes directly back to the Bible. Some people don't believe in the Bible. Me, I believe every word in it. I think if you believe one word you have to believe all of it. It does say in the Bible that believers should not be with non believers. That is in black and white and leaves little doubt as to what is meant. Millionman brought this up after almost two pages. When I read the initial post this was the first thing that came to my mind. What I would like is for someone to show me in the Bible that Pre marital sex is wrong. In the front of the Bible it speaks often about things that are sexually immoral. I don't think that it is specific about premarital sex with someone you truely love. It also doesn't speak about masturbation. If God saw these things as terribly wrong don't you think that he would have said in black and white that these things are sexually immoral. Also Jesus is not God. It is pretty plain in the most known verse in the Bible, John 3:16 that Jesus is Gods son. It also says that no man can come to the father unless it is thru the son. It is a sad fact that the Church is in the state it is in. Yes the divorce rate is higher than it should be in and out of the church. Just because someone goes to church or is a church member doesnt mean that they are going to live for the Lord and do his will. Every man who stands in the pulpit and preaches is not a man of God either. I will promise you that a true man of God will never take advantage of your wife or girlfriend. Now I didn't say that this couldn't happen in a church environment I just said that a TRUE man of God wouldn't do this. Also one last thing, It is in the Bible many times that divorce is wrong and it even states that God HATES divorce. There is not but one reason that is grounds for divorce and that is adultery. It is also plain that if a person is divorced from their spouse that they should reconcile with them or remain unmarried. If these principles were obeyed I can just about guarentee you that the divorce rate would be almost zero. I think that the problem is not what's in the Bible , it's the way it's being applied.

55, I agree with you, that yes Christ is the son, but it as I have already discussed that Christ places himself on the same level of God, meaning they are the same, it's a trinity, three parts whole yet separate entities. Luke 5:20, Jesus heals the paralytic, but before that Christ says "Friend your sins are forgiven" "He goes on to say, which is easier to say, "Your sins are forgiven, or to say Get up and walk? But that you may know that the Son of Man has authority on Earth to forgive sins...." The biggest problem most people seem to have with this discussion is whether or not Christ is God, and the answer is he can be nothing else. He is the son, yes that's true, but He is also God, again being 100% man and 100% God is not an easy thing for us to comprehend. There are several books by well versed and highly thought of writers who have written about this concept in great detail one being my favorite C.S. Lewis, Mere Christianity is a difficult read, but very informative. I hope some of you guys get intrigued enough about this subject to at least find out about it. It's one thing to say something does not work, but if you know nothing of the subject at hand, How can you claim it does not work???

Chevy, I agree with you about the church. Great statements. I hope you are blessed all your days.

How about this. If my dad sent me to the store, and the manager asks "where did you come from?" and I replied "From the one who sent me." Would that mean that I was in fact my dad? No, it would mean my dad was the one who sent me here.

Also on the where in the Bible does it say that pre marrital sex is a sin. In Exodus IIRC, it speaks of a persons nakedness as being only for themselves or their husbands..or wifes. Theres alot being said there than just a simple sentence. In alot of the Bible things are implied over and beyond the surface of a simple statement or verse, and you have to dig deep to get the full meaning of it. I guess the argument could be made like... "if we have sex with the lights out then I wont see her nakedness" ....Well, excuses are easy to make if thats the case, and you know when your making them.

Pharoah, I think your love for this girl is commendable. However, I have to agree with some of the others in questioning such a relationship long-term. I was raised in a Christian home, followed the religion for many years, and now consider myself non-religious. Just with the moral foundation and belief structure alone that believing in the basic teachings of the Bible has left me, I could never have a relationship with an atheist. I just think a belief a a higher power and an afterlife of reward or punisHydromaxent shapes so much of a person's actions that I can't imagine it ever working.

Yes, Christ said He was sent by the Father, but what about the Holy Spirit, it was sent and appeared as a dove descending from the sky, when Jesus was baptized, but yet if you blasphemy in the Holy Spirit you are barred from entering heaven. Does that mean the Holy Spirit is not God, that emplies the opposite, it again was sent by God, but yet is equal to Him. My point again is to say Christ, the Father, and the Holy Spirit are three things separate but each is part of God. It's known as the Holy Trinity for that very reason.

Well, in regards to pre-marital sex, scripture says that there are certain things that are to be kept between a married man and woman. A whole other aspect of it is in 2Timothy 2:22, it says to flee from the appearance of evil, including and specifically those things sexually immoral. Matthew 5:27-30 which discusses looking at a woman with lust and it equalling adultery, which would mean if you weren't married to her you would be comitting adultery, which would be pre-marital relations would it not. God makes it very clear that marriage was created for the joys of marriage, song of songs, and also ecclesiastes when he speaks of sexual impurity brining no happiness as that of the wedding bed. I've been down this road before trying to make it seem like because I loved her and I was going to spend the rest of my life with her it was alright, even though in my heart I knew I was wrong. I made a huge mistake believing that, and if cost me the woman that I really cared for, and now we don't speak or IM or anything, and for me it was one of the hardest things I have ever dealth with. It matters a whole lot when it comes down to it, some say it doesn't but I those are the ones that I never see in relationships and they ask why can't I maintain a relationship. Physical love does not equate to true love, I found that out at the end of my last realtionship.

I think you missed my point Millionman. I belive it the same way you do.

I got you. I didn't think my earlier posts made a lot of sense once I reread them, I sometimes have a hard time expressing myself openly on the forum. So I get kind of scatter brained, especially when it comes to faith. It's just one of my many struggles. Thanks for posting Flair, and anyone else who has stood up for your faith, the Body of Christ needs soldiers who will go out and spread the Gospel. Even if it's over the internet, it has to take place some where.

Buddy, you define the word "whipped". My suggestion to you is to forget about the size of your dick for a minute and grow some balls. Guys like you make it too easy for guys like me. Go get some practice with some sluts, come back and fuck her right this time. If you can get a girl off, she'll never cut you off.

You can have all the quantity you want, I'm going to hold out for quality. Sounds to me like Pharoah has that in his mind. I do agree with you to a degree, you can't place women on a pedestal and pamper them or kiss their butts. You have to know who you are and what you stand for, otherwise you stand for nothing and fall for anything, and no woman would ever be satisfied in a wishy washy do anything she wants relationship. At the same time you don't have to call him out, he cares for the girl and it matters enough to him to try to maintain the realtionship. I've been around a good bit, and it's not a rewarding life, all it got me was a lot of pain and suffering at my own selfish hand. So I wait patiently for my wife, and woman still love me, there's no law against being charming and charismatic, no one ever said being a Christian had to be boring. You have to live life, and enjoy the days God has given you, so why not enjoy yourself within His word, there's plenty we have fun with, it's not all rules and regulations.