In the 1930 we were victims of propaganda...it is 2007???

stridge said:
I can't tell if Pandora is being serious or not, but in the event that he is, I'd say 10inch is far more correct in his arguments.

The physiological facts are that there is no lethal toxicity level of THC saturation in humans - you can't do immediate harm to yourself smoking pot. On the other hand, thousands of people in the US alone drink themselves to death every year. A person of low bodyweight or tolerance can drink themselves to death in 15 minutes with a cheap bottle of vodka. One study often cited involved reserachers injecting rats with a chemically enriched THC formula that would have been the equal of a human consuming the THC content of several hundred joints, all at once. The rats passed out and slept soundly for about a day, came to, and had no adverse health effects whatsoever. Try to imagine what would happen if you intravenously exposed a rat to the proportional equal of a human consuming even a hundred beers or shots of liquor. Actually, you don't need to imagine, because I can assure you that the result would be instant death. So, there's one plus for pot.

Secondly, no study (and there have been many) has shown that marijuana and THC create a chemical dependency in the human body. Mental and social dependency, just as with any other substance, but you do not develop a cellular need for the substance. Alcohol, on the hand once again, is physically addictive and can literally rewire the brain and organ function of a drunk so that they must have the substance to function normally. Another plus for pot.

Essentially, the risk associated with smoking pot in terms of health is related to long-term heavy usage possibly altering memory and certain cognitive function - which is still a fairly unknown realm of research. Also, just like smoking tobacco, marijuana contains tar, carbon, and carinogenic compounds that probably aren't too great for you. This is, however, small potatoes compared to the severe health problems that alcohol fosters in its abusers. Regular heavy drinking is directly linked to such a large number of chronic illnesses and health disorders that I won't even bother listing them. Pot, on the other hand, has been hailed by medical researchers and practical experience for its medicinal effects and ability to aid those suffering from afflictions ranging from cancer to glaucoma to chronic pain.

Also, Pandora, the example about the guy going berserck on his family - just because he was growing pot doesn't mean he was under the influence of marijuana or that had anything to do with his violent and insane behavior. You're taking an example of association and assuming it to be causation. He could have been on other drugs, had a long history of mental illness and violence, etc, but suggesting that the fact that he had pot plants around is somehow directly linked to the brutal slaughter of his family is beyond a far stretch of logic.

Frankly, I don't understand how anybody could seriously make the argument that pot is somehow more 'dangerous' or 'risky' than booze, especially considering the the poor judgement and aggressive behavior that alcohol has been proven to insitigate in many individuals, especially at high levels of consumption.

That being said, I still prefer drinking.
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I feel that, their has not been a good enough study on the Psychosis effects is could possible have on a human.

What a discussing anyway, I tell you I don't know where I even get this stuff from some day lol.
 
Pandora said:
You speak of all these things that sound very persuasive, but why is it still not legal then, because one thing that I have no doubt about is that weed does cause some kind of Psychosis effect on a the human brain, try going 5 years or so without it, and watch the behavior patterns of people around you who still smoke it, and then see if you still feel the same about.

Or forget that, I know from first hand experience of really abusing the drug, of what Psychosis effects it can have, which is still with me in some way to this very day, whether that is a good or bad thing I don't know. lol
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I was around friends who started experimenting with cannabis at the age of 13. I never smoked until I was almost 18, so I have seen how people react under the influence of marijuana with my "pure" view. I was scarred of marijuana until I saw my friend do it when he was in middle school. I was expecting him to start going crazy or something. Instead, he was very relaxed and he had calmed down a lot (ADD stuff). I couldn't believe it! He actually could function normally as if he hadn't smoked! Whereas when I saw people that were drunk they were violent and couldn't control themselves. I was pro marijuana long before I ever smoked it myself.

I don't know what the hell you're talking about with the "weed does cause some kind of psychosis." Sorry, but I really have no clue what you're talking about. If you met me, or any of my other friends, you'd have no proof or question into whether they smoke weed. Of course, my friends are well-educated, motivated college students. Pandora, marijuana does NOT cause psychosis in people who are not pre-disposed to it. Even, using these 40% figures, it is still no problem. Here's some math for you:

1 in 100 people (approx) suffer from psychosis. That's 1% of the population.

Let's add in this supposed (not proven to cause psychosis before it has naturally occured) 40% figure for marijuana: That's 1 + 40%(1) = 1.40

Now, let's look at my limited research into alcohol psychosis: According to eMedicine - Alcohol-Related Psychosis : Article by Michael Larson, DO : "Roughly 3% of persons with alcoholism experience psychosis during acute intoxication or withdrawal." I have no idea how many alcoholics there are.

The funny thing is that, while marijuana usage has significantly increased, the psychotic population has not. Therefore, all this 40% study suggests is that now 40% of psychotic people are using cannabis. Note, cannabis did NOT cause psychosis in those people who did not already have it!

Honestly Pandora, if you were having some type of psychosis, which you lead me to believe, you might have a very serious mental disorder that needs to be addressed.



And why is it not legal yet? Because of people who fear and toss out the truth. Many-a-lie is spread about cannabis, all unscientifically based.
 
Alcholism runs in my family and recently my brother has become one. He would also mix it with pills like zanax. I've seen him go through a lot of shit and cause a lot of serious problems within our huge family (I'm 1 in 8 kids). And this past week a distant cousin of mine got drunk and took some zanax's and then shot himself through the chest with a shotgun.

Now my brother has done pot since he was in middle school...however he has also been a trouble maker and lived life on the edge. He might be addicted to adrenaline or something is my hypothesis. He has done a lot of light and heavy drugs. Now according to this "research" he might be another statistic even though it is his own stupid self-indulgence and personality that lead him to getting high and drunk. He went to the doctor and told him everything. About the pot, the drinking, the smoking, and all the other drugs he has taken. The doctor told him that it was drininking not pot thats gonna kill him. Prohibition didn't work so why is the ban on a much milder drug working...racism and money.

I've known very normal, hard-working people who have done pot for a long time with no adverse side-effects. As with any drug the use of pot can get out of control but pot is not physically addictive so as long as you make sure your not smoking everyday and getting behind in the times I don't think its a big deal. I've taken a two month break and when college was in and I was doing it I only at night before I went to bed and only after I got my schoolwork done. Its very possible to be dedicated, smart and use pot to relax every now and then.

I can just smell the bias in a story like this report. I mean comeon people were basically saying "we don't know for sure....blah, blah, blah, but lets make sure to prove it true." Not to mention the disclaimer at the end of the story. I mean I believe maybe we should try to find causes of psychosis but this is missreporting. Even if marjuana does bring psychosis out...in what 800 people it only brings it out sooner than it would have. But this is a high maybe because there is no evidence that pot causes permanent damage to the brain.
 
I don't really have much to throw in to this thread because I don't smoke anything, nor do I necessarily want weed to be legalized because of those who would abuse it. I know, people abuse everything, blah blah blah.

"Propaganda is the deliberate, systematic attempt to shape perceptions, manipulate cognitions, and direct behavior to achieve a response that furthers the desired intent of the propagandist."
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If the government, scientists, etc truly think this stuff is bad, is this really evil propaganda like DLD said? If that's how it is, then every single news is propaganda. I suppose some might believe that, but people will always have intentions. I for one don't really like popular news. For some reason I don't think anti-weed people are trying to ruin your lives though. I don't see why an article with scientific backing is somehow an evil plot.
 
doublelongdaddy said:
unnnnkay

MrMackey.jpg
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Oh GAY!!!!!

​
 
Coca is a plant that can be chewed. Cocaine is taken out of coca leaves with jet fuel and acetone. Petroleum and acetone cannot be grown organically.

PCP is not marijuana. Apples and oranges, guilt by association, irrelevent.

Should eating should be against the law if feeling tired due to food allergies is sure to happen to a lot of people?

Most psychopaths will try marijuana, glue and gasoline sniffing, OxyContin, meth, and beating their heads against walls, driving cars, reading books. Guilt by association is not logical.

I prefer not to alter myself with substances but I believe marijuana was outlawed by those desiring a monopoly on hemp for rope(think Navy contracts). They put small and medium hemp growers out of business by passing a law. Hemp is also the best source of oil for bio-diesel.

The Reefer Madness movie was on TV last month. I saw it for the first time. Ridiculous propaganda from the hemp(rope) monopoly.
 
The propaganda used to say that marijuana causes impotence via estrogen dominance and vitamin C depletion. They just pull phrases out of the air to serve an agenda. How about premature ejaculation? Sounds good, print it, get paid.
 
pnoewbe said:
The propaganda used to say that marijuana causes impotence via estrogen dominance and vitamin C depletion. They just pull phrases out of the air to serve an agenda. How about premature ejaculation? Sounds good, print it, get paid.
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Fuck, more like ejaculate whenever you want!
 
I actually rememeber during my own k-12 education (which wasn't too long ago) strongly implied that smoking weed could heavily boost your estrogen levels and cause you to grow breasts. Also, the whole "gateway drug" theory was really hyped. They essentially made it sound as if we were all just a few blunts away from laying in a gutter somewhere jonsing for our net syringe full of black tar heroin.
 
stridge said:
I actually rememeber during my own k-12 education (which wasn't too long ago) strongly implied that smoking weed could heavily boost your estrogen levels and cause you to grow breasts. Also, the whole "gateway drug" theory was really hyped. They essentially made it sound as if we were all just a few blunts away from laying in a gutter somewhere jonsing for our net syringe full of black tar heroin.
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They made us think that there was just one category of "drug users." Where that one group just did any and every drug available to them. Like true junkies.
 
Yeah, I think some of it can be just chaulked up to cultural hysteria. During the Reagan 80s and even during H.W. Bush, the whole "Drug War" concept and the idea that we can irradicate drugs from society (or at least middle class white society, which in all reality is all that most federal anti-drug crusaders really cared about) were very popular. Hundreds of billions of dollars and a lot of wasted effort later, there isn't much change.

The number one factor contributing to abuse and availabiity of hard drugs is generally lack of education and poverty. So, the problem really isn't the drugs themselves, it's the terrible living situations and lack of opportunity that make people feel like destroying themselves with dangerous street drugs is preferable to dealing with reality - but it's a lot easier to just point a finger at all drugs instead of a broekn system.

Unfortuantely, there is a profit driven element to this as well. The US has more of its citizens locked up in prisons that any other nation, and the vast majority of crimes are drug-related (and many are non-violent, particualrly in states with the draconian three-strikes laws concerning drug offenses). This is very big business for private contractors prison management companies, and they lobby just as hard as the drug companies to make sure that mainstream America still believes that marijuana is somehow more dangerous than booze.

When I worked in politics it was always tremendously frustrating to me that more elected officials weren't willing to really call anybody else out or draft some legislation meant to start targeting this kind of bullshit. Unfortunately a lot of that has to do with the fact that many smalltown USA sorts of places are ecnomically dependent on jobs at a prison, and so the first thing that happens if a politician wants to cut prison funding or obstruct the system in any way is that the PR folks start accusing them of destroying a town's livelihood and ruining the lives of decent, hardworking people. On top of that, opposition to the prison system makes it all too easy for critics and challengers to make you out as "soft on crime," so that compounds the first problem.

I personally don't think the problem will get solved until this country has a major shift in its attitudes about drugs and crime - owning up to the fact that pot is no different and probably much better than drinking alcohol is the first step.
 
stridge said:
Yeah, I think some of it can be just chaulked up to cultural hysteria. During the Reagan 80s and even during H.W. Bush, the whole "Drug War" concept and the idea that we can irradicate drugs from society (or at least middle class white society, which in all reality is all that most federal anti-drug crusaders really cared about) were very popular. Hundreds of billions of dollars and a lot of wasted effort later, there isn't much change.

The number one factor contributing to abuse and availabiity of hard drugs is generally lack of education and poverty. So, the problem really isn't the drugs themselves, it's the terrible living situations and lack of opportunity that make people feel like destroying themselves with dangerous street drugs is preferable to dealing with reality - but it's a lot easier to just point a finger at all drugs instead of a broekn system.

Unfortuantely, there is a profit driven element to this as well. The US has more of its citizens locked up in prisons that any other nation, and the vast majority of crimes are drug-related (and many are non-violent, particualrly in states with the draconian three-strikes laws concerning drug offenses). This is very big business for private contractors prison management companies, and they lobby just as hard as the drug companies to make sure that mainstream America still believes that marijuana is somehow more dangerous than booze.

When I worked in politics it was always tremendously frustrating to me that more elected officials weren't willing to really call anybody else out or draft some legislation meant to start targeting this kind of bullshit. Unfortunately a lot of that has to do with the fact that many smalltown USA sorts of places are ecnomically dependent on jobs at a prison, and so the first thing that happens if a politician wants to cut prison funding or obstruct the system in any way is that the PR folks start accusing them of destroying a town's livelihood and ruining the lives of decent, hardworking people. On top of that, opposition to the prison system makes it all too easy for critics and challengers to make you out as "soft on crime," so that compounds the first problem.

I personally don't think the problem will get solved until this country has a major shift in its attitudes about drugs and crime - owning up to the fact that pot is no different and probably much better than drinking alcohol is the first step.
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Ya but that'll take years. All the older people (those who grew up before the 70s) will need to die out to get a real voting majority established. That's going to be at least another 20 years.
 
It's hard for me to see anything related to weed. Man I could go for a dutch right now. Man protest this muthafucking bullshit. I hate all this political shit. Fuck cops, lawyers, judges, I really think this system is fucked up. Nothing but sucker asses running the damn thing, money is there Achilles heel.
 
ithiel said:
It's hard for me to see anything related to weed. Man I could go for a dutch right now. Man protest this muthafucking bullshit. I hate all this political shit. Fuck cops, lawyers, judges, I really think this system is fucked up. Nothing but sucker asses running the damn thing, money is there Achilles heel.
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It is funny to see how much utter bullshit is prevalent and un-needed or overused in our society. I wish sociologists could do a study on cavemen in real time to see the effects of their lifestyle.
 
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