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[MAXAMEYES]

Thanks guys, one of the points to ponder I was bringing up was the fact that Man, as a species, is probably the most adaptable single species on the planet. Inuit prove you don't really need vegetation, vegetarians prove you don't really need meat. Many vegetarians don't eat meat for moral reasons while, as I pointed out in an earlier thread, most indigenous peoples recognize and give deeply held gratitude for the sacrifice of life involved in eating flesh.
Each has quite a large spiritual component.
( I've always said that if everyone had to slaughter and prepare their own meat, there'd be a whole lot more vegetarians in the world.)

Anybody who has ever spent any amount of time out in "the real world" recognizes that Man is simply another component in and of this world. About the only reason I think that human life is intrinsically more valuable than an animals life is that humans can dedicate themselves to a purpose. Humans can, through altruism, benefit others by sacrificng themselves, with no thought of personal gain or even desire for thanks. Something which runs completely counter to the most basic of survival instincts and is an almost exclusively human activity. Self-sacrifice is not a Darwinian adaptation. It is a conscious decision, a recognition that there exists in the universe something, (or many things), much greater than oneself, and that dedicating ones energy, or life, toward perpetuating that greatness, that purpose, is a worthy goal.

 

[penguinsfan]

You are not mistaken. There are also other similiar studies. As I mentioned before though, the comparison of fruit and animal rights is ridiculous. Fruit doesn't care for and raise it's young, maintain life long relationships, or mourn for the loss of family members. Many mammals and birds do. Earlier another member mentioned that some animals at times eat their young. Well sometimes women kill their newborns and children so what's his point of even bringing that up? How many times do you hear newscasts about that as well as men killing their step-children (lion/cub scenario). My point is simply that the animal kingdom and man show amazing parallels with each other. The same arguement cannot be supported about fruit.

You are right that animals show the complex relationship aspects of raising their young, mourning for lost family members, etc. They certainly have a far more complex and detailed existence than that of plants, but humans take it to a far greater level. Humans show many emotions that are not seen in the animal world, design complex structures and solve great scientific or mathematic challenges, and work towards the preservation of species that are endangered (Do animals show concern for our well-being?). As I stated earlier, I do not like to see cruelty to animals. I do not criticize vegetarians or vegans for their lifestyle and in fact admire the discipline, but it's not going to be for me. The whole point I'm making is that of course it would be insanity to suggest that killing an animal is equal to killing a plant. But there is as much insanity from those that truly suggest that killing an animal and a human are just as equal, IMHO.

 

[nobody]

I'm not sure if I have mentioned this before but I'm a hardcore insomniac most of the time. I went to bed after 2am and woke up to take a whiz at 4:12am and then of course couldn't go back to sleep. I missed the first ten minutes or so but I was watching this documentry on HBO called "Dealing Dogs". It was about these animal rights activists who went undercover for about six months to gain evidence of the living hell that dogs go through in the kennel to animal research racket. I'm a pretty emotionaly reserved guy most the time but it made me cry.

For all of you out there who think animals don't need humane treatment and that all these groups exagerate the circumstances of the horrors we put on our animal bretheren you are so full of shit. It's so easy to stick your head in the sand and just say the problem doesn't exist or refuse to get involved personally. It's no big deal right? Just the way it is right? Spineless fucks. The fuckin' demons that show documented and all the others like them I would gladly snatch the life out of in a heartbeat. I wouldn't lose a night's sleep over it either.

 

[iwant8inches]

Man, I saw that documentary. It made me damn near cry. I saw it I believe late on Sunday night or maybe Monday. I was going to post about this myself, but I forgot what it was called and school got in the way. Man, when the under-cover investigative reporter didn't speak up for that one dog that they shot in the head was when I about lost it. It's making me well up right now man. My dog was sleeping nearby and I probably hugged him twenty times the next day. Love my dog...I almost couldn't watch it all.