Hello! New Joiner, 6 months of PE

Hi all! New joiner here,
I'm truly amazed after reading about everyone's PE experiences and believe this platform will help with my own journey. It seems like each day I'm absorbing new information here and considering new techniques/programs, although I probably need to familiarize myself with all this new terminology first.
I've started to incorporate some manual stretching into my routine a few days ago (hands only, no equipment); basic stretching techniques, bundled stretches, and BTC stretches. Just wanted insight on how often I should be performing these exercises -> how long should each stretching session be? how many sessions per day? how many per week?

BACKGROUND:

Phallosan Forte - I started PE approx. 6 months ago as I've been dealing with ED for the past year. After using only PF, I was able to secure 0.5" inches in length after 6-7 weeks of use (min. 6hrs x 5 days per week). This was my initial realisation of how effective PE can be. I continued to use PF for an additional 4 months and had upgraded to a Phallosan Plus during this time, but unfortunately it seemed that my gains had started to slow down and I'm worried that I've plateaued. For the past month, I switched up my routine by using Phallosan Plus as a full-time ADS stretcher, hoping to gain better results by utilizing more intense stretching.

p.s I now understand that most people here aren't the biggest fans of PF lol. I've noticed on a few threads that people have expressed how PF isn't an effective device for long-term gains, otherwise open to any other tips.

Bathmate Hydromax - Started using this device approx. 4 months ago as my first pump. Average routine consists of BM's recommended 3min sessions x3 (5 days per week total), only used in the shower (typically erect). No permanent gains as of yet but have noticed temp gains growing over time. More specifically, the length of my shaft has progressively grown within the chamber, plus I've noticed my shaft has gotten thicker during my more recent sessions (feels bigger when fitted through my fingers using an 'ok sign'). Although no perm gains were made, one of the greater benefits were an improvement in EQ strength (erection feels rock solid).

Unfortunately, I've experienced my first thrombosis vein injury approx. 3 weeks ago which resulted in a sharp soreness along some parts of my shaft and foreskin (I'm uncut) with semi-visible veins. Around that time I decided to take a break from pumping to recover, and lost my EQ strength which was disappointing. However, I have recently used a heparinoid cream (Hirudoid) in small doses for a short period, which alleviated most of the swelling but effectively stopped the pain.

btw...my research about penile injuries is what led me to discover this platform to begin with lol

Overall, hoping to get back into pumping sooner than later

MOSRED - My first purchase from MOS! Red light therapy has always intrigued me, especially with all the studies made on hair regrowth, skin, health etc. Purchased one last week to experience it for myself, in the hopes of recovering from ED. Currently on day 4 of MOSRED, and my first impression was that it's made a slight positive change to my libido, my shaft feels slightly thicker but most of all my ballsack feels loosened and hanging after a 10min session (suppose its a good thing for stretching/pumping). Looking to utilize 2x 10min sessions per day (one during the morning as a PE warm up & one after PE work). Distancing myself 6 inches away, but possibly 7 or 8 to begin with in case I experience any adverse reactions.

The only thing that I'm uncertain about is this subtle but weirdly lasting sensation in my balls since using MOSRED. It doesn't really feel painful but perhaps its just more sensitive at this stage. Is this something that I should be concerned about? Does this feeling usually subside? Should I maybe use MOSRED on my penis only (instead of penis & balls)? Is there generally a point where I should limit myself from LED light exposure (while I understanding that MOSRED recommends daily usage)?

Appreciate your feedback/suggestions! I'll probably have more questions to share in the future

kppaaaaa said:

The only thing that I'm uncertain about is this subtle but weirdly lasting sensation in my balls since using MOSRED. It doesn't really feel painful but perhaps its just more sensitive at this stage. Is this something that I should be concerned about? Does this feeling usually subside? Should I maybe use MOSRED on my penis only (instead of penis & balls)? Is there generally a point where I should limit myself from LED light exposure (while I understanding that MOSRED recommends daily usage)?

Appreciate your feedback/suggestions! I'll probably have more questions to share in the future

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I'm a manual stretcher, I use RED + NIR during this process for 30 min a day and then the 5 x 5 x 3. I have been using RED + NIR on my body for 6 months now , practically 4 to 5 times a week. No issues at all. If I am just using it for just warm up, All I need is 10 min. If I am doing stretches then I add this to the routine

Having balls exposed to RED light has been clinically proven to be OK or beneficial. No reports I have seen of anything negative. But it's your body so you can cover it with cloth as needed.

RED + NIR for the most part MAX a day is usually up to 30 min but trust your body in what it wants. That does not mean that 30 min is better that just means that the MAX for the most part is 30 min a day. I am just saying that most studies, in general, have been all under 30 min for Red Light.

Also, every Red light is different so find the distance and time that works best for you.

Last, I don't do Bathmate, I use something similar to mityvac, if you have gotten injured, I recommend using a pump and gauge so you know how much pressure you are at. I like knowing my Hg.

Welcome brother. This is where the true PE journey starts. What the companies don't tell you, the brotherhood here will. As brother bemorethanbig said, don't go to the max levels without gauging your body's limits first, either be for the Bathmate or the MOS Red. Based on the various clinical and studies for red light therapy, 35 J/cm^2 for the region should be the daily dose limit. Using MOS Red, that's around 15 minutes. If you suffer an injury, say, a cut, a damage, or blister, 20 minutes is fine. However, 15 minutes is more than enough. Using more of it doesn't benefit anything. There is a diminishing of return once you hit the daily dose. The mitochondrial powerhouses need to use up before recharges can occur. That takes up to 18 hours. If you constantly using it every 12 to 18 hours, you simply stress the powerhouses out. Think about a battery being constantly charging and discharging. Stresses will degrade and destroy the powerhouses. New cells simply replicate the same damages powerhouses.

As for why your groin/scrotum feels sensitive is due to either too long of light therapy or sunburn effects. Your skin will be very sensitive after photo burn (light burn), similar to after long sunburn. Remember, you groin doesn't get exposed to light 24 hours a day since the day you were born, unless you live at a nudist colony. Sudden light exposure will cause sensitivity.

As for the Bathmate HydroMax or HydroXtreme, make sure to look up up at the mods with gauges. If you are using a trigger pump upgrade,ake sure to follow us on a larger water trap mod as well. In due time, MOS Shop will have the mods available. We are testing them out right now. A gauge is critical to know your lower and upper pressure limits. Going to far and too hard, thrombosis and tissue damages, beside blisters, will occur. Bathmate does not have a good routine for the products. The true wisdom of Bathmate is here with the brotherhood and slowly being copied by other forums.

oldandlively said:

As brother bemorethanbig said, don't go to the max levels without gauging your body's limits first, either be for the Bathmate or the MOS Red. Based on the various clinical and studies for red light therapy, 35 J/cm^2 for the region should be the daily dose limit. Using MOS Red, that's around 15 minutes. If you suffer an injury, say, a cut, a damage, or blister, 20 minutes is fine. However, 15 minutes is more than enough. Using more of it doesn't benefit anything. There is a diminishing of return once you hit the daily dose. The mitochondrial powerhouses need to use up before recharges can occur. That takes up to 18 hours. If you constantly using it every 12 to 18 hours, you simply stress the powerhouses out. Think about a battery being constantly charging and discharging. Stresses will degrade and destroy the powerhouses. New cells simply replicate the same damages powerhouses.

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Very interesting information.
I always went 15 to 30 minutes per day, but I suppose 15 minutes of that 30 minutes was a waste of time.

Yes it's really important to gauge the pressure when pumping. As @oldandlively wrote in post , implementing a gauge on your Bathmate or implement the MityVac water trap modification on your Bathmate.

It's not necessary to know the vaccum pressure with Bathmate when starting out, but it will sure be beneficial to at least know what vaccum pressure you are at. Some have managed to inquire themselves by going to high in vaccum. This is something you want to prevent. And we do kot want this to happen.

In my experience Bathmate can be a good beginner pump, and will also work for experienced pumpers, but there is an even more comfortable pump in MOS Shop, called: MityVac - Wet and Dry Penis Vacuum Pump System.


With this system you will have even more control of your vacuum pressure, since you will be able to see the vaccum pressure constantly. But with Bathmate modifications you can only se3 the vaccum pressure when you add more vaccum pressure (due to Bathmate's valve system).

I have used both pump systems and I have many Bathmate pumps, so I know what I'm talking about.

MityVac - Wet and Dry Penis Vacuum Pump System, is the winner here. I'm not just saying that. I'm pumping with it with water now and it's superior to Bathmate. Much more comfortable and you have fine tuned control of the vaccum pressure you are using.

squirt_inducer_man said:

Very interesting information.
I always went 15 to 30 minutes per day, but I suppose 15 minutes of that 30 minutes was a waste of time.

Yes it's really important to gauge the pressure when pumping. As @oldandlively wrote in post , implementing a gauge on your Bathmate or implement the MityVac water trap modification on your Bathmate.

It's not necessary to know the vaccum pressure with Bathmate when starting out, but it will sure be beneficial to at least know what vaccum pressure you are at. Some have managed to inquire themselves by going to high in vaccum. This is something you want to prevent. And we do kot want this to happen.

In my experience Bathmate can be a good beginner pump, and will also work for experienced pumpers, but there is an even more comfortable pump in MOS Shop, called: MityVac - Wet and Dry Penis Vacuum Pump System.

MityVac - Wet and Dry Penis Vacuum Pump System

After 15 years of research and development with the veterans of penis enlargement, MOS is proud to announce the MityVac HydroVac Penis Pump system.Whether you are just enlarging the penis or want to do full package pumping with your penis and testicles, the MityVac HydroVac offers a wide range...

shop.mattersofsize.com

With this system you will have even more control of your vacuum pressure, since you will be able to see the vaccum pressure constantly. But with Bathmate modifications you can only se3 the vaccum pressure when you add more vaccum pressure (due to Bathmate's valve system).

I have used both pump systems and I have many Bathmate pumps, so I know what I'm talking about.

MityVac - Wet and Dry Penis Vacuum Pump System, is the winner here. I'm not just saying that. I'm pumping with it with water now and it's superior to Bathmate. Much more comfortable and you have fine tuned control of the vaccum pressure you are using.

Click to expand...

Best pump ever and soon even better

Did have misspelled words in post #4 above.
inquire should be injure.

Here to provide an update 1 week later! Happy to see everyone's suggestions and I'm thankful for all your help

So far I have continued my routine consisting of manual stretches (exploring newbie exercises, seeing which works best for me), ADS stretching and warming up/down using MOSRED (10min intervals).

MOSRED - The sensation in my balls appears to have subsided, so if anything this was probably by body getting use to red light exposure as a start. Still monitoring closely in case I come across anything related to burns/skin irritations so probably best to take a conservative approach during this time. However, it's definitely handy when it comes to stretching as my balls are able to hang low after a MOSRED session.

Now for some good news...

GIRTH GAINS - After using manual stretches for the first few days since last week, I can definitely feel some girth gains. I haven't been able to take proper measurements but my shaft feels firmer and wider. I can see and feel the difference when I fit my penis inside my Phallosan Plus, and it's slightly made a positive change in EQ. After stretching for the first few days, I was experiencing a level of soreness across my shaft (for maybe 1-2 days) so perhaps this is generally a sign of solid gains to come? I'll keep this in mind when I go through each stretching session.

PUMPING/THROMBOSIS - I've paused pumping for the time being as I can still see thrombosed veins within parts of my penis, although I'm unsure if its a good idea to take a break for too long. The veins aren't really painful when touched however I'm only concerned that this would flare up again even more if I decided to jump back into my usual pumping routine. Are there any ways to get a speedy recovery for thrombosis? Warm compress? Topical creams? I wonder if Vitamin E oil might solve it if I apply it across my shaft. Currently, I have been using Vitamin E since using my ADS stretchers by applying it on my frenulum after each session to prevent tears (super helpful btw!). Otherwise, I'm keeping an open mind when it comes to Bathmate mods/MityVac as previously suggested. I haven't tried any air-pumps before and I'm not that savvy with hand-pump usage, but perhaps I'll research further.

LENGTH IS THE MAIN GOAL - Discovering my girth gains was truly incredible, and I now understand the importance of manual stretching and the potential it has for overall gains. However, my main objective is to gain length in the fastest way possible. Learning as much as I can about all these exercises, routines and PE devices, but just trying to figure out where else to start or how else I can accelerate my routine as a new-ish stretcher. If anything, I'm yet to try out jelqs and kegels, so perhaps I'll ease into it at some stage. Curious to know what the ideal frequency/duration of each exercise should be. At this stage, bundled stretches and BTC stetches seem to work well, but maybe I should incorporate other stretches?

SLEEVES - One last topic, I've only just discovered the importance of using sleeves/wraps after stretching. This probably would've helped me achieve quicker gains if I knew about this sooner lol. I've tried using my current sleeve from my ADS stretcher, and left it wrapped around my shaft after finishing a session of ADS. So now I can actually see that my penis is able to stay in its elongated shape and can probably heal better in this state. Is there a general timeframe of how long I should use a sleeve for? Interested to see if this will impact my gains in any way, especially when paired with MOSRED.

kppaaaaa said:

PUMPING/THROMBOSIS - Are there any ways to get a speedy recovery for thrombosis? Warm compress? Topical creams?

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After the routines, shiatsu style massage along the entire length of the shaft for the thrombosis using warm oil (keep a few drops of oils for usages in a container sitting in a hot water bath), use warm compress for 15 minutes, moderate wrap around affected areas down to 2 inches in each direction when possible as compression. Make sure it's still loose enough for proper blood flow. This can be paired as elongated wrapping. Wear it as long as you can. Make sure to drink a baby aspirin (75mg to 85mg per day) to prevent any possible blood clotting.

kppaaaaa said:

LENGTH IS THE MAIN GOAL - At this stage, bundled stretches and BTC stetches seem to work well, but maybe I should incorporate other stretches?

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Find 5 stretches, and use them for a few weeks. Around 3 is best. Them switch out another 5. Keep alternating to prevent tissues from adapting.

kppaaaaa said:

SLEEVES - Is there a general timeframe of how long I should use a sleeve for?

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Just like above, to combat thrombosis and to remain elongated, wear it as long as you can. There is no daily limit. Just like medical practices, you wear compression as long as feasible and personally comfortable until the issue subsides.

********PLEASE HELP********
Guys I'm so upset, I've just had a major setback and lost approx. 0.5" inches in length. Originally noticed an itchy/tingling sensation on the underside of my glands (unlikely to be a skin irritation) for the past 2 days and speculated that this might be a general sign of gains to come. I've been going about my usual PE routine however I think the only contributing factor I can think of that may have caused this might be a topical hair treatment I've been using for approx. 4 weeks now (2-3 times per week). Of note, the treatment consists of a serum consisting of various oils e.g peppermint, rosemary, lavender purchased from the chemist and used topically in low doses. Studies say that these are known to be DHT-inhibitors.
I probably should've shared this when I first joined MOS for clarity, but the reason I started PE was due to side affects from hair regrowth treatment that I was using about a year ago (shedding hair; in my mid-20's) which appears to have caused penile atrophy. I made the mistake of using Saw Palmetto/Serenoa oral treatment for hair regrowth purposes (which I convinced myself was a natural alternative to other mainstream chemicals for hair regrowth, after some research). Looking back, there was no benefit gained from this treatment and unfortunately lost about 1-1.5"inches from my original length. This has easily been one of by biggest regrets and has fucked up my dating/sex life to say the least.
After some time looking into the topical treatment my impression was that this would've been safer than oral treatment but not many studies saying that its directly linked to penile atrophy as work is done on the scalp (so therefore likely to be transmitted into the bloodstream). Have now stopped using any hair regrowth treatments altogether.
PE journey seems to be getting more difficult from here so I'm pretty much trying to figure out the quickest way to regain my original length (and more).
That being said, I've ordered Lengthmaster 3 last week which has now arrived, so will start using immediately with the beginner routine. Ordered a Silisleeve in addition to keep elongated for as long as possible. Sadly, what was once my flaccid length has now become my elongated length.
Think I just really need some reassurance during this time and am wanting to know how fast PE users have made gains from the LENGTHMASTER 3 (keeping in mind that everyone has a different rate of growth). Just feeling really disheartened and defeated after all this time and effort put into PE.
Without a doubt I know I've still made my most significant gains after joining MOS just over a month ago, and even gained a little more size in girth since my last update. Seeing how much I've accomplished over the past month makes me wonder if I'm truly able to get my length gains back ASAP. Really keen to hear your thoughts/suggestions.

Current routine consists of:

• 10min session MOSRED x2 daily (warming up & warming down)
• Basic stretches (using up/down & diagonal stretches)
• Bundled stretches (left & right)
• Dual fulcrum stretch
• BTC stretches (works the best to keep me elongated)
• Started Broomstick routine a week ago
• Started wrapping 3 weeks ago

First of all, calm down. Your gains you've made have not been lost but converted from length to girth. It's not 1 to 1 ratio, but 1 to 0.25 ratio. The compounds you were using, especially Saw Palmetto/Serenoa contains high concentration of phytoestrogens, with a high dose of synergistic blood dilatory responses. Have you noticed that you got more hardness from the erection during masturbating and sexual intercourses? The reason why is the high concentration of dilatory compounds were still in the system and caused your blood to pump harder. While doing PE, your girth gains tend to pull from your length during this period because there was too much tissue restrictive stresses for elongation (length) while the medical tissues relaxed to accommodate for the higher blood flow, gaining you girth.

Worry not, your elongated tissues are still there, hidden in the base of your penile body, slightly more dense due to the heavy cocktail of the phytoestrogens and inhibitors. They must leave your system before your PE can be effective once again. Phytoestrogens will fight against your natural production of testosterone, promotion the needed growth. In addition, the phytoestrogens will also reduce the emergence of your own small doses of human growth hormone when your penile body is under stress loads.

For now, think of your penis like a lily plant. All your hidden growth is being condensed into dense tissues at the base of your penis in a dormant state. It will take just a bit of time for you to stretch out the dense tissues and recover what you thought you lost and believe you got an explosive growth in the process. Use the Length Master will be your saving grace due to the amount of traction force you can act upon the dense tissues.

Let's do this. Admin @squirt_inducer_man @DLD @huge-girth can one of you pull this thread and dump it over to the personal Routine and Progress subforum? Also rename the title to our brother's kppaaaaa personal progress log page?

@kppaaaaa make sure to provide us more info, such as any meds you are on, supplements you're using, and any additional tools you have beside what you mentioned. Also, check out our brothers' detailed log pages to copy their methods of reporting to provide good trend info so we can provide clearer suggestions

You can also request our brother @huge-girth for one on one coaching as well. Anything you postG here can become public info if you have too many personal info to keep private. Otherwise, you scenarios can offer other brothers needed info to protect and improve themselves as well.

To counteract the existing phytoestrogens and inhibitors in your systems now, my suggestion is to grab some bulk HMB powder, Vit D3, and l-citrulline malate supplements. I got mine from Bulk Supplements via Amazon. Why these three for the moment? They assist with the softening of the tissues, act as blood reinforcement in pushing resources to your lower extremities, and reboot your natural testosterone productivity. You don't have to us them if you don't want to. This is your call. You can do further researches to authenticate what I'm telling you before pulling the trigger to purchase.

If you decide to use the supplements and PE routines, we will provide you the needed consumption info and routine requirements. BUT, you are to observe and fine tune your routines according to your needs.

Let us know how you want to proceed.

Wow thanks for the amazingly quick response haha! Apologies if my post sounded a bit overreactive as I've only noticed these changes overnight.

So if I understand this correctly, the shortage in length isn't necessarily a sign of lost gains but rather has been converted into girth, and therefore requires some intense stretching (with the help of Lengthmaster3) for invisible penile length to be pushed back out. Currently looking into the LENGTHMASTER video tutorials shared by @huge-girth, plus checking other logs that share more info about the do's & dont's of LENGTHMASTER 3.

But yes that's definitely an insightful theory, which is interesting since I've been using manual stretches/ADS so I thought that I'd solely gain in length but instead have resulted in girth gains (without even pumping/jelqing during this time). Will definitely share updates on any new gains and other observations.

I forgot to mention that I've continued using Phallosan Plus for ADS-stretching (5 days per week, avg. 4-6hrs) in addition to my routine as noted above. However not sure if this is still deemed effective during this phase? since it only keeps me elongated for a few hrs compared to intense manual stretches. Sidenote -> I've utilized a trick with the extender where once my penis reaches a 'jelly-like' state then I'm able to add additional gold bars to the extender since my penis is in a greater state of flexibility. This was my other major strategy used for the past few months but wonder if this has helped anyone else majorly.

As for the recommended supplements, I've only experimented with l-citrulline malate (several months ago) in the hopes that it would enhance blood flow. But will make sure to look into all recommended supps. Also aiming to use VitD & Magnesium tablets on a 1 per day basis.

I've hardly touched Saw Palmetto now (was taken some time last year, one month duration, never used since). Same goes for topical oil (used for about less than 1 month, last used 3 days ago), still skeptical about this treatment so wont touch this.

Again, thanks so much! As someone who owns a lily plant ill keep this theory in mind about my penis.

kppaaaaa said:

Wow thanks for the amazingly quick response haha! Apologies if my post sounded a bit overreactive as I've only noticed these changes overnight.

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Overnight changes are common as your body tends to do heavy regression on growth as a mean of instinctive preservation. We fight with this natural instincts constantly in PE. We actually are fighting back against our own DNA limitations.

kppaaaaa said:

So if I understand this correctly, the shortage in length isn't necessarily a sign of lost gains but rather has been converted into girth, and therefore requires some intense stretching (with the help of Lengthmaster3) for invisible penile length to be pushed back out.

Click to expand...

Yes. What you are doing is merely a lower intensity side of the routines, with cocktails of supplements that worked against you in the past. Going forward, we'll find a better routine for you to use as a template and you can modify it according to your growth needs. Just like a recipe, everyone has a different reaction to a base recipe and modify accordingly to enhance the tastes in their own preferences. In this case, it's the growth needs.

kppaaaaa said:

But yes that's definitely an insightful theory, which is interesting since I've been using manual stretches/ADS so I thought that I'd solely gain in length but instead have resulted in girth gains (without even pumping/jelqing during this time). Will definitely share updates on any new gains and other observations.

Click to expand...

For some, manual stretches refocus on medial expansion (internal expansion) rather than the lateral (force of outward expansion and elongation). This is why we have to introduce a more aggressive elongation to introduce micro tears along the entire penile shaft. That requires 5lbs of traction force for a minute or two. Since you wear the ADS for a while, you may need that extra 2lbs of traction force for 30 seconds to induce sudden trauma for a micro tears and reduce back to 5lbs for continuous traction force to keep the micro tears going. We'll share more as you have the LENGTHMASTER in your hands.

By the way, make sure to read up on the comfort and reinforce mods for the LENGTHMASTER in its subforum.

kppaaaaa said:

I forgot to mention that I've continued using Phallosan Plus for ADS-stretching (5 days per week, avg. 4-6hrs) in addition to my routine as noted above. However not sure if this is still deemed effective during this phase? since it only keeps me elongated for a few hrs compared to intense manual stretches.

Click to expand...

Looks like you discovered the lack of tension force with the Phallosan Plus to deal with your elongation needs. You probably only use 1.5lbs worth of tensions and your tissues requires up to 2lbs and towards 2.5lbs to overcome the retraction strength. Great job in noticing it early in the game.

kppaaaaa said:

Sidenote -> I've utilized a trick with the extender where once my penis reaches a 'jelly-like' state then I'm able to add additional gold bars to the extender since my penis is in a greater state of flexibility. This was my other major strategy used for the past few months but wonder if this has helped anyone else majorly.

Click to expand...

This is just one of the tricks in the book. You will need this for the higher intensity workouts for the LENGTHMASTER. By allowing the loser state, you can go even further on the pulling and tugging.

kppaaaaa said:

As for the recommended supplements, I've only experimented with l-citrulline malate (several months ago) in the hopes that it would enhance blood flow. But will make sure to look into all recommended supps. Also aiming to use VitD & Magnesium tablets on a 1 per day basis.

Click to expand...

Great combo to keep the tissues relaxed and the muscles to recover after a stressful bout. My suggestions is to use half dose of l-citrulline malate (2g) with the full load of HMB (4g), on top of 4,000IU of Vit D3 a few hours before the routines, and half of the l-citrulline malate during the routine in a form of hydration purpose. Your system will blood blood flow for resource delivery during this time. If you are drinking calcium, ease back on the Vit D3 to 1500IU.

kppaaaaa said:

I've hardly touched Saw Palmetto now (was taken some time last year, one month duration, never used since). Same goes for topical oil (used for about less than 1 month, last used 3 days ago), still skeptical about this treatment so wont touch this.

Click to expand...

Saw Palmetto can bioaccumulate and stay in your system for 9 months after reaching a certain concentration. Depends on what you're eating as well, the concentration tends to linger past a year.

kppaaaaa said:

Again, thanks so much! As someone who owns a lily plant ill keep this theory in mind about my penis.

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We will force that lily plant to bloom and turn into a natural force of wonder. Hang in there brother.

oldandlively said:

Overnight changes are common as your body tends to do heavy regression on growth as a mean of instinctive preservation. We fight with this natural instincts constantly in PE. We actually are fighting back against our own DNA limitations.


Yes. What you are doing is merely a lower intensity side of the routines, with cocktails of supplements that worked against you in the past. Going forward, we'll find a better routine for you to use as a template and you can modify it according to your growth needs. Just like a recipe, everyone has a different reaction to a base recipe and modify accordingly to enhance the tastes in their own preferences. In this case, it's the growth needs.


For some, manual stretches refocus on medial expansion (internal expansion) rather than the lateral (force of outward expansion and elongation). This is why we have to introduce a more aggressive elongation to introduce micro tears along the entire penile shaft. That requires 5lbs of traction force for a minute or two. Since you wear the ADS for a while, you may need that extra 2lbs of traction force for 30 seconds to induce sudden trauma for a micro tears and reduce back to 5lbs for continuous traction force to keep the micro tears going. We'll share more as you have the LM in your hands.

By the way, make sure to read up on the comfort and reinforce mods for the LM in its subforum.



Looks like you discovered the lack of tension force with the Phallosan Plus to deal with your elongation needs. You probably only use 1.5lbs worth of tensions and your tissues requires up to 2lbs and towards 2.5lbs to overcome the retraction strength. Great job in noticing it early in the game.


This is just one of the tricks in the book. You will need this for the higher intensity workouts for the LM. By allowing the loser state, you can go even further on the pulling and tugging.


Great combo to keep the tissues relaxed and the muscles to recover after a stressful bout. My suggestions is to use half dose of l-citrulline malate (2g) with the full load of HMB (4g), on top of 4,000IU of Vit D3 a few hours before the routines, and half of the l-citrulline malate during the routine in a form of hydration purpose. Your system will blood blood flow for resource delivery during this time. If you are drinking calcium, ease back on the Vit D3 to 1500IU.


Saw Palmetto can bioaccumulate and stay in your system for 9 months after reaching a certain concentration. Depends on what you're eating as well, the concentration tends to linger past a year.


We will force that lily plant to bloom and turn into a natural force of wonder. Hang in there brother.

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You are so special and I am forever in your debt 💗

Here with a small update on Lengthmaster 3 usage

Impressed by the minimal hand effort required for stretching when compared to manual hand stretches. Currently utilizing the newbie routine in 20min sessions x2 (one during the day, one during the evening) and will spend time in-between using my Phallosan extender or healing in a Silisleeve. Aiming to take one rest day every 3 days of LENGTHMASTER usage.
So far I'm able to rotate 180 degrees (and a smidgen more) before I can reach a full 360 degree turn. There isn't much length that I can fit inside the chamber at this stage so I'm clamping closer to the base. I can mainly feel the stretch around by penis base. Overall, wondering if my current form sounds like it needs any improvement? Also using a Theraband + bandage wrap in addition, making sure that my foreskin is pulled back as best as possible.

Only questions I have regarding LENGTHMASTER 3 is how long each stretch in each direction should last for? Should I be progressively building up to do longer holds while using the newbie routine? And how much longer should I use the newbie program before incorporating a more intense stretch (like BTC)?

I know it feels a bit uncomfortable & embarrassing to look at/touch at this length but just reminding myself that my current gains are just compressed in girth-form for now...
With that being said, I'm still able to force a bit of a hands-free erection with some strength, compared to when I was first hit with ED & before I started PE. So perhaps that probably reinforces the theory noted above. Ngl I used to be able to do that hanging shower towel trick with my knob with such ease (iykyk)so hoping I get there again.

oldandlively said:

Saw Palmetto can bioaccumulate and stay in your system for 9 months after reaching a certain concentration. Depends on what you're eating as well, the concentration tends to linger past a year.

Click to expand...

Would you say that the same theory applies to any topical hair treatments used in the past (even in low doses as previously mentioned)? as in would any of the chemicals last in my system for much longer that may counteract any PE? Planning on using the recommended supplements to help detox. Starting with Vitamin D3 and now I've re-ordered L-Citrulline Malate.

In the meantime, any other thoughts on other supplements such as Maca Root, Tribulus?

kppaaaaa said:

So far I'm able to rotate 180 degrees (and a smidgen more) before I can reach a full 360 degree turn. There isn't much length that I can fit inside the chamber at this stage so I'm clamping closer to the base. I can mainly feel the stretch around by penis base. Overall, wondering if my current form sounds like it needs any improvement?

Click to expand...

That's perfectly fine. In due time, the length and rotations will not be a problem. Just be careful and not go too zealous mode before you can fully condition your glans and penile tissues to handle the higher intensity. Take it one step at a time.

kppaaaaa said:

Only questions I have regarding Lengthmaster 3 is how long each stretch in each direction should last for?

Click to expand...

The original recipe (sounds like I'm promoting KFC and Church's fried chicken or something) goes for 30 seconds per stretch. However, you can fine tune according to your needs going as high as 3 minutes per stretch due to limited length. Customize according to your current needs. I'm currently using 1 minute per stretch right now, to fill up my 40 minutes routine. 5 different directional stretches, 10 minutes routine at a time, total of 4 breaks to get the blood flowing. Too long without allowing the glans to relax will cause the glans to suffer.

kppaaaaa said:

Should I be progressively building up to do longer holds while using the newbie routine?

Click to expand...

Yes. 30 seconds is standard. 60 seconds for intermediate. Up to 3 minutes of extreme intensity for advanced or customized needs. What you are looking for is that dull pull feeling. The trick to find out that dull pull is to pull your foreskin completely back, grap hold the base of your glans, and pull downward until you get the achy dull pull feeling. That is your ligaments and tissues under stress. If you feel pain at the base, you gone too far, especially that feeling of just your skin being pulled. This is due to poor wrapping method.

kppaaaaa said:

And how much longer should I use the newbie program before incorporating a more intense stretch (like BTC)?

Click to expand...

As little as 20 days, and as long as 60 days. Some have sensitive skin tissue. That requires a bit longerbto build up the needs. By the way, grab yourself a moderate size tube of 0.5% to 1% hydrocortisone on your way home from work next time. You will need it to reduce the total amount of irritation and inflammation from over working your sensitivity skin at the beginning. If you don't have time, buy it from the MOS store to deliver straight to your mailbox.

kppaaaaa said:

I know it feels a bit uncomfortable & embarrassing to look at/touch at this length but just reminding myself that my current gains are just compressed in girth-form for now...

Click to expand...

You work on PE to improve yourself. Do not compare to others on any level. You set your objectives to find the improvements you need, and never look at others for comparison. You can use them as references but never to compare yourself to them. You have positive points that they don't have and they have positive points that you don't have. Work hard for your own improvements and needs. Never feel embarrassed or down about such trivial matters. We are all here to find ourselves and not to indulge on the naked people movie aspects as entertainers to make it your reality. If you find someone that compares you to others, you are in a toxic relationship. If that personal encourages you and thank you for improving yourself to fulfill them for their needs, that person is a keeper.

kppaaaaa said:

With that being said, I'm still able to force a bit of a hands-free erection with some strength, compared to when I was first hit with ED & before I started PE. So perhaps that probably reinforces the theory noted above. Ngl I used to be able to do that hanging shower towel trick with my knob with such ease (iykyk)so hoping I get there again.

Click to expand...

You will. PE improves various parts of the penile health. Just need to stick with it and find one solution at a time. We will offer our collective knowledge as best as we can.

kppaaaaa said:

Would you say that the same theory applies to any topical hair treatments used in the past (even in low doses as previously mentioned)? as in would any of the chemicals last in my system for much longer that may counteract any PE?

Click to expand...

Yes. Any internal consumption of chemical cocktails will cause bioaccumulation. The body will try hard to get rid of the uncertaint or unnecessary concentration. This is where your kidneys and livers get the big hits. Too much stresses, your system suffers and attempt diversion of resources to heal both organs. Since your penis is last on the list for anything, it takes the biggest deficit cut of resources meant for growth. Low doses add up over time, just like fat clogs your arteries or your sewer drains over time. What you don't see, it will surface its ugly head later. You already see it for yourself.

kppaaaaa said:

Planning on using the recommended supplements to help detox. Starting with Vitamin D3 and now I've re-ordered L-Citrulline Malate.

Click to expand...

Do ease up on the Vit D3 if you have other supplements with Vit D in the list. Total should not exceed 4000IU. On top of that, if you are taking calcium, back off more. Medical journals have been warning that too much VitD and calcium caused too much unneeded absorbed calcium in the system, creating havocs on the internal balances.

kppaaaaa said:

In the meantime, any other thoughts on other supplements such as Maca Root, Tribulus?

Click to expand...

Try Hawthorne extracts (berries and leaves) to boost libido, which enhances the blood flow to command erection on demands. Maca root extract is also good, but bioaccumulation can create unwanted side effects. Rather than try to refocus on ED and blood flow, supercharge your system with antioxidants instead to induce protective resources and growth potentials.

oldandlively said:

That's perfectly fine. In due time, the length and rotations will not be a problem. Just be careful and not go too zealous mode before you can fully condition your glans and penile tissues to handle the higher intensity. Take it one step at a time.


The original recipe (sounds like I'm promoting KFC and Church's fried chicken or something) goes for 30 seconds per stretch. However, you can fine tune according to your needs going as high as 3 minutes per stretch due to limited length. Customize according to your current needs. I'm currently using 1 minute per stretch right now, to fill up my 40 minutes routine. 5 different directional stretches, 10 minutes routine at a time, total of 4 breaks to get the blood flowing. Too long without allowing the glans to relax will cause the glans to suffer.


Yes. 30 seconds is standard. 60 seconds for intermediate. Up to 3 minutes of extreme intensity for advanced or customized needs. What you are looking for is that dull pull feeling. The trick to find out that dull pull is to pull your foreskin completely back, grap hold the base of your glans, and pull downward until you get the achy dull pull feeling. That is your ligaments and tissues under stress. If you feel pain at the base, you gone too far, especially that feeling of just your skin being pulled. This is due to poor wrapping method.


As little as 20 days, and as long as 60 days. Some have sensitive skin tissue. That requires a bit longerbto build up the needs. By the way, grab yourself a moderate size tube of 0.5% to 1% hydrocortisone on your way home from work next time. You will need it to reduce the total amount of irritation and inflammation from over working your sensitivity skin at the beginning. If you don't have time, buy it from the MOS store to deliver straight to your mailbox.


You work on PE to improve yourself. Do not compare to others on any level. You set your objectives to find the improvements you need, and never look at others for comparison. You can use them as references but never to compare yourself to them. You have positive points that they don't have and they have positive points that you don't have. Work hard for your own improvements and needs. Never feel embarrassed or down about such trivial matters. We are all here to find ourselves and not to indulge on the naked people movie aspects as entertainers to make it your reality. If you find someone that compares you to others, you are in a toxic relationship. If that personal encourages you and thank you for improving yourself to fulfill them for their needs, that person is a keeper.


You will. PE improves various parts of the penile health. Just need to stick with it and find one solution at a time. We will offer our collective knowledge as best as we can.


Yes. Any internal consumption of chemical cocktails will cause bioaccumulation. The body will try hard to get rid of the uncertaint or unnecessary concentration. This is where your kidneys and livers get the big hits. Too much stresses, your system suffers and attempt diversion of resources to heal both organs. Since your penis is last on the list for anything, it takes the biggest deficit cut of resources meant for growth. Low doses add up over time, just like fat clogs your arteries or your sewer drains over time. What you don't see, it will surface its ugly head later. You already see it for yourself.


Do ease up on the Vit D3 if you have other supplements with Vit D in the list. Total should not exceed 4000IU. On top of that, if you are taking calcium, back off more. Medical journals have been warning that too much VitD and calcium caused too much unneeded absorbed calcium in the system, creating havocs on the internal balances.


Try Hawthorne extracts (berries and leaves) to boost libido, which enhances the blood flow to command erection on demands. Maca root extract is also good, but bioaccumulation can create unwanted side effects. Rather than try to refocus on ED and blood flow, supercharge your system with antioxidants instead to induce protective resources and growth potentials.

Click to expand...

Incredible advice 👏

1 week of Lengthmaster:

Finally adapting to the routine of 2x 20min sessions and fair to say I can definitely feel soreness to an extent. I've been able to reach a full 360 degree rotation during one of my sessions but otherwise I can stretch up to 180 degrees. At this stage it seems a bit hit & miss with how far I can rotate, but I suppose there could be various factors impacting this, might depend on my current technique, wrapping or level of intensity. Dealing with cold weather as well so the skin of my penis & scrotum also feels a bit restricted, perhaps temperature is affecting how far I can stretch, otherwise it feels like I'm ripping my skin if it doesn't feel relaxed.

On another note, I can definitely feel soreness during and outside of my LENGTHMASTER routine, which often comes and goes in phases. Think I can mostly feel a sore sensation within my ligaments, I've been experiencing some sore points lingering around the penis base area on most days. I can also feel short lapses of inner penis soreness (I assume this could be the 'dull pain' mentioned in previous posts), although they don't show up as often as the soreness in my ligs. Inner penis soreness is especially noticeable in an elongated state (when I wear my ADS stretcher), so I'm beginning to see a pattern there.

I'm sure these are meant to be positive signs of a solid stretch + potential gains to come, and not just ripping skin As far as manual bundled stretches go, think I've been able to reach a new level of intensity which might have added to my ligs soreness. Perhaps this is because I've been stretching at a certain length/distance based on my previous measurements, which overall results in a greater pulling force.

But for now, might take a rest from LENGTHMASTER today. Glands are feeling a bit soft/limp so I think I may have overworked my penis a bit while using by regular routine in addition to Lengthmaster. Will bounce back soon

Wow. You went pretty hard core on the first week there. 2x10 minutes on the Length Master should be sufficient to get the ligs and tissues going. Overworking the tissues straight out the gate can cause more fatigues and lack of gains than you may think. Start slowly to allow the penis to adapt. 10 minutes session at a time, unlock the plates, massage the penis to allow blood to flow a bit, even a good old SSJ to get the blood pumping, and then the next set. Don't go straight for 20 minutes and make your glans suffer.

oldandlively said:

Wow. You went pretty hard core on the first week there. 2x10 minutes on the Length Master should be sufficient to get the ligs and tissues going. Overworking the tissues straight out the gate can cause more fatigues and lack of gains than you may think. Start slowly to allow the penis to adapt. 10 minutes session at a time, unlock the plates, massage the penis to allow blood to flow a bit, even a good old SSJ to get the blood pumping, and then the next set. Don't go straight for 20 minutes and make your glans suffer.

Click to expand...

Noted, i'll take it easy next time around with 10min sessions. Think I only just went a bit harder on yesterdays session. Thankfully it doesnt feel as though ive caused any kind of serious damage. Will use MOSRED for extra healing.

Take you time as you go on. Stick with your routine until there is a lack of growth. From there add time and intensity