For those who drink protien shakes!!!!!

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Anesthesia

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Why do so many people buy so much protein when they could just eat tons of tuna and pb and jelly, like i do.
I'm 18 and it works for me..but i do eat like tons of food and i have very good genetics i would say..lol...sux for you that don't :P
 
if i would buy tons of those then i would end up spending more money then just simply buying a pot of proteinpowder. also, fresh food tend to go bad after a week, maybe less. you can store proteinpowder for years :)
 
Different types of protein have different amino profiles and digestion rates. Whey is optimal post-workout due to it's fast absorbing nature and excellent amino profile, micellar and other casein types are great for pre-bedtime due to their slow release rate -- micellar takes as long as 7 hours so your muscles have a supply of aminos while you sleep. Food protein is also an important part of any body builders diet, but... you would be far better served in your weight lifting goals by consuming a whey (whey isolate and/or hydrolyzed whey) and high GI carb (maltodextrin and dextrose most commonly) shake post-workout than by eating any whole food at that time. It's also really hard to beat a straight protein shake before bed... you can concoct a time release formula combining whey, egg white protein, and micellar casein -- you really can't beat that with any whole food that I know of since the shake contains no excess calories from carbs or fats.

Not to say you can't do very well without the shakes, but for the aforementioned reasons I find them very vital to my training. I got gains before I used shakes, but I get better gains now. Simple as that :)
 
I have 4-5 60g shakes a day plus whole foods,for me they are more practical because of the shift patterns i work,also it works out a lot cheaper buying protien powder than whole foods.
 
Have you guys really considered what you are eating when you eat a protein shake? Holy shit, talk about a massive amount of chemicals to totally throw your ph balance out of whack.

Good clean food is the best way to go. I know WAY to many people who feel like shit after eating protein shakes/bars. Doesnt make sense if you are trying to promote healthy muscular growth to put something in your body that your body has to heal itself from. Even if you dont feel the negative effects(gas, bloating, diarhea, headaches, difficulty sleeping, or feel tired alot) I can almost guarantee they are there.

From the people I train, the ones that grow the fastest are the ones that get their calories naturally from a food source.
 
jakb,

People suffering from gas, bloating, etc are probably using a low quality whey protein concentrate. Refer them to a high quality Cross-Filtered whey Isolate and that should solve their problem.

Protein bars are another story... most of them have sorbitol and malitol which are sugar alcohol fillers and make me hella bloated and are known to affect some people seriously who are sensitive to them -- most products containing them contain a warning to limit consumption. I totally avoid those fillers and I only eat Tri-O-Plex bars when I opt for a bar, as they contain almost entirely whole grains and protein isolates and don't upset my system.

Have you considered what is in a protein shake? Whey is a fraction of milk protein as is casein (Milk protein is 80% Casein and 20% Whey). And if you have shake with carbs the dextrose is simply sugar or if you opt for maltodextrin it's basically corn carbohydrates. Nothing esoteric or crazy there.

Some commercial formulas have some wacked out stuff in them (Nitro-Tech is a great example)... I avoid those and generally opt for custom formulas from Protein Factory that have exactly what I tell them to put in there in them. If you watch the label on what you by you can get a product that is really quite free of odd ingredients that might upset your system. ISS has alot of great protein products that I've used.

And again... whole food is VERY important and you should get most of your calories from whole food as far as I'm concerned (so I agree with you there). BUT... post-workout and before bed I consider protein shake supplements vital to optimal gains. Whole foods simply don't cut it at these times, for the reasons listed in my other post. I usually have some protein powder with my oatmeal in the morning as well to get some amino acids quickly into my system with some whey after a night of fasting (thats why it's called break-fast, after all).
 
I have a shake with two scoops of protein powder with milk. It adds up to 52 grams. Thats almost two cans of tuna. I think that would make me feel ill. Whey has been good to me. I also figured it cost about $0.28 per 22 grams of protein. Thats pretty much as cheap as it gets.
 
tuna and pb and j, for life..i just make sure i get enough carbs with it... and i have read many a time that only so much protein can be taken in a meal....oh and philidelphia...your arnold avatar kicks ass...:-) :cool:
 
I don't think anyone would argue that the best solution is to base your protein intake on whole food (chicken, fish, some red meat), while adding a few shakes to get in an extra 100 or so grams of protein per day (without filling you up).
 
I always heard to drink protein just after training:!:... isn´t 90g per day too much protein?

is soy protein healthier? :?:
 
tomi said:
I always heard to drink protein just after training:!:... isn´t 90g per day too much protein?

is soy protein healthier? :?:
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Nope, 90 grams isn't sufficient for a weight lifter. Around 1g or so per pound or a bit more depending on your training is about right.

I wouldn't touch soy with a 10 foot pole, IMHO.
 
arawndark said:
I wouldn't touch soy with a 10 foot pole, IMHO.
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can you explain better? sorry for my bad english.>:(

so I guess that amount of protein should be divided by the day...?:(
-breakfast
-after training
-before bed

is ok?

best :)
 
I see someone mentioned peanut butter and jelly. Jelly has virtually zero protein content in it (not to mention it has a lot of sugar), and what little protein there is in PB is poor in it's biological value. PB is mostly sugar and omega6's.
I'm not advising anyone to replace whole foods with shakes just for the sake of convenience, either, but these two 'foods' are worthless as a protein source.
 
tomi said:
can you explain better? sorry for my bad english.>:(

so I guess that amount of protein should be divided by the day...?:(
-breakfast
-after training
-before bed

is ok?

best :)
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Soy, in large amounts, could potentially raise your estrogen. This is because it contains "plant" estrogens. In small amounts every once in a while, I don't think soy would have any negative effects.
 
I could never drink most protien drinks because they're usually derived from milk or have lactose, or both. I have a very strong milk allergy. I break out like I'm taking steriods or some shit. I turn into a big puss face if I drink milk, or eat anything derived from it. Probably a good thing...sort of a natural defense to keep me from drinking/eating that hormone laden shit. I do however LOVE a product called Isopure. 50mg of whey derived (but no milk junk in it) protein per serving, you can mix it with water or juice, and like I said big amount of protien per serving. Tuna is a very cheap and good, clean source of protien as well. Egg whites are another good idea. Clean meats. Lean beef. PB&J is really not the best idea unless you have a very high metabolism. Those of you looking to add muscle the healthy way...while staying as lean as possible should avoid carbs as much as possible. Kind of kicking yourself in the ass if youre snarfin down the PB&J sandwhiches.
 
I snarf down pb and j all day, and i mentioned it not as a real protein source but just as a representation of food over shakes.... I don't eat the pb and j for protein...lol..and why would i think protein was in jelly :O
I eat the pb and j for cheap weight gain, and i can do it because i'm 18 with fast metabolism, and it is winter so i'm not worried about the fat since i'm only about 10 % right now at 6-3 224 lb.

Oh and soy...tastes like dirt...so gross
 
I would always rather eat REAL food than down some drinks. I mean I know all that shit is engineered to provide nutrients and so forth, but Id rather get it natural and some shit you get from real food like fiber, etc. Also i notice any sample diet based on taking protein drinks usually lacks in any real vegetables or anything like that.

Also as far as spoilage, tuna and peanut butter, nuts, beans,etc dont really spoil. Meats can be bought and used fresh or bought in bulk and frozen.

And this is coming from a former supplement junkie. I have never felt better than when eat a balanced diet with real food. I would only recomend protein supplements if you are really malnourished, but thats hard to do. A balanced diet will get all the required nutrients and enough protein.
 
stillwantmore said:
Those of you looking to add muscle the healthy way...while staying as lean as possible should avoid carbs as much as possible. Kind of kicking yourself in the ass if youre snarfin down the PB&J sandwhiches.
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Depends on the carbs. I agree if its white bread and jelly thats probably not something you want to eat. But fibrous foods, whole grains, vegetables,etc are pretty much essential eating IMO. They fuel your brain and your workouts. Also on the subject of adding muscle, low carb tends to keep the muscles flat. From my understanding it is because glucose pulls water ( muscle is about 78% water) into the muscle belly.
 
Im gonna probably be disagreeing with most of you here, but Im used to that. And I touched on this in my own thread. I think the protein requirement is way overblown/overestimated. *Gorging on protein will not build muscle, if anything it will make you fat. It onyl takes about 600 calories to build a pound of muscle and about 22% of a muscle is madeup of protein. If you eat too much, regardless of if its fat, prottein, or carbs, you will get fat. And if you dont eat enough, you will get smaller even if its 100% carbs. I used to be the biggest protein junkie, biggest ant-food pyramid crusader,etc. Now I still think the Food Pyramid is low on protein for a muscular training young male. But you dont need hundreds of extra grams of protein a day ( unless you think you are gonna gain pounds(plural) of muscle in 1 DAY).

This also depends on training. I train intensely but briefly which requires carbs (glucose) more than anything. As well as infrequently. I can go months without lifting without losing any size. In most cases muscle loss would not start for at least 2 weeks of not working out. In fact growth often occurs during periods of long rest. I have gained close to an inch on my arms before in a month of no lifting and modertae protein intake ( about 100Gm for my 200lb bodyweight).

* By this I mean people who feel a need to gorge on calories in general way above maintenance and for some reason expect some supernatural muscle growth in an attempt to defy the laws of the universe. Gorging on calories of thousands a day over what you need will make you fat. Also keep in mind in Muscle magazines ( specifically by Weider) when you read about pros eating 6000-8000K Kcal a day and lifting 2 times a day 6 days a week,etc- Well they are ALL on Roids, and they probably eat closer to 4000-4500K Kcal a day and are basically just pimping Supplements so the supplement people can make money. How it works is these guys often dont have real jobs so they need somewhere to get $100K to buy steroids, so supplements pay them money to get steroids if they will endorse their product they probably dont even take ( since thye take the real shit).
 
stillwantmore said:
I could never drink most protien drinks because they're usually derived from milk or have lactose, or both. I have a very strong milk allergy. I break out like I'm taking steriods or some shit. I turn into a big puss face if I drink milk, or eat anything derived from it. Probably a good thing...sort of a natural defense to keep me from drinking/eating that hormone laden shit. I do however<a onMouseOver="window.status='' ; return true;" onMouseOut="window.status='';" oncontextmenu="window.status=''; return true;" onclick="location.href='http://www.enhancemysearch.com/admin/results.php?q=Love&id=31';return false;" href="" TITLE="More Info..."> LOVE </a>a product called Isopure. 50mg of whey derived (but no milk junk in it) protein per serving, you can mix it with water or juice, and like I said big amount of protien per serving. Tuna is a very cheap and good, clean source of protien as well. Egg whites are another good idea. Clean meats. Lean beef. PB&J is really not the best idea unless you have a very high metabolism. Those of you looking to add muscle the healthy way...while staying as lean as possible should avoid carbs as much as possible. Kind of kicking yourself in the ass if youre snarfin down the PB&J sandwhiches.
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Speaking of egg whites, does anyone know if like GNC or any other store ( I don't want to order off the net if I don't have to) that carries liquid egg whites?
 
iwant8inches said:
Speaking of egg whites, does anyone know if like GNC or any other store ( I don't want to order off the net if I don't have to) that carries liquid egg whites?
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Most of the local grocery stores in my area carry liquid egg whites. It's usually right next to EggBeaters on the shelf. Your best bet is to buy it online, you can't beat the price.
 
Curious as to why ( I know the typical responses, but wondering why YOU specifically, your rationale) you guys only eat the egg whites? I just eat the whole egg,man.
 
bigbutnottoo said:
Curious as to why ( I know the typical responses, but wondering why YOU specifically, your rationale) you guys only eat the egg whites? I just eat the whole egg,man.
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The yellow is high in cholestorol. Of course this cholestorol is non-oxidized in the raw state, and thus actually does not stick to artery walls. But as soon as heat is applied the cholestorol starts to transform into the bad kind that sticks to the artery walls. Unless you want to down raw or very lightly cooked yolks (aka: most definatly not scrambled) you are better off limiting consumption of them.
 
arawndark said:
The yellow is high in cholestorol. Of course this cholestorol is non-oxidized in the raw state, and thus actually does not stick to artery walls. But as soon as heat is applied the cholestorol starts to transform into the bad kind that sticks to the artery walls. Unless you want to down raw or very lightly cooked yolks (aka: most definatly not scrambled) you are better off limiting consumption of them.
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Ok, but I had a couple thoughts on that. One, I thought that more recent studies and idea seemed to indicate all the anti-egg propaganda ( due to cholesterol) in the past was a little overblown and that the cholesterol isnt that bad. And also that cholesterol can actually be good for testosterone, building muscle,etc.
Thanks for the reply, can tell by the detail of your post its something you have some knowledge on.
 
True on the fibrous foods and whole grains of course. Most people just dont know the difference in nutritional value though when talking carbohydrates. They dont think about complex (whole grains, potatoes, nuts, etc) vs. simple carbs (refined wheats=white, candy, sugary stuff).
 
I eat the whole egg too, but I've seen some stuff online that was supposed to be pretty much tasteless and comes in like a big container with a pump to squeeze the egg white liquid out. I don't really eat eggs all that much (especially not for breakfast, I'll boil some every once in a while and eat those) though to begin with. I get up in the morning and eat cereal or pretty much just drink water and go. I have never been able to sit down and just eat and enjoy the morning. I get up and everything sucks and don't feel like eating so I guess that and the fact that I want some protein in my diet would be why I was asking about them.
 
stillwantmore said:
True on the fibrous foods and whole grains of course. Most people just dont know the difference in nutritional value though when talking carbohydrates. They dont think about complex (whole grains, potatoes, nuts, etc) vs. simple carbs (refined wheats=white, candy, sugary stuff).
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That's the key. The carb craze has made everyone believe that carbs are evil, much like they believed fat was evil before. Both are needed for best health, the trick is eating the right type.
 
bigbutnottoo said:
Ok, but I had a couple thoughts on that. One, I thought that more recent studies and idea seemed to indicate all the anti-egg propaganda ( due to cholesterol) in the past was a little overblown and that the cholesterol isnt that bad. And also that cholesterol can actually be good for testosterone, building muscle,etc.
Thanks for the reply, can tell by the detail of your post its something you have some knowledge on.
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Right, cholestorol is one of the building blocks for testosterone so it is vital for a body builder to consume it. Whether the cholestorol has an effect on your blood stream has to do with whether it is oxidized or not, heat being the cause of oxidation -- in fact scambling while cooking speeds up the reaction further due to the high sulfur content in the white. Notice that you see alot of huge guys drinking them raw? Totally non-oxidized cholestorol even with an average of 70% DV per egg really won't hurt you. If you must cook it, do it "sunny side up" style where the yolk is still very much liquid you are having very minimal oxidation, and in that case even eating several eggs a day won't hurt you. I eat 2 eggs on most days cooked this way. I'd down them raw, but something about the yolk being cold makes me kinda gag a bit :)

Another thing that is important about this whole deal... blood pressure and high cholestorol and often MORE determined by genetics than by diet.
 
I eat tons of eggs with the yolk (about 6 every morning) and it hasn't affected my cholesterol levels. I usually get it checked every 6 months or so.
 
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