Discuss

The evolution of religion has been traced from early fear and ghosts down through many successive stages of development, including those efforts first to coerce and then to cajole the spirits. Tribal fetishes grew into totems and tribal gods; magic formulas became modern prayers. Circumcision, at first a sacrifice, became a hygienic procedure.

doublelongdaddy said:

The evolution of religion has been traced from early fear and ghosts down through many successive stages of development, including those efforts first to coerce and then to cajole the spirits. Tribal fetishes grew into totems and tribal gods; magic formulas became modern prayers. Circumcision, at first a sacrifice, became a hygienic procedure.

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Complicated one but here goes, one theory is that our religion comes from the ancient wisdom of the peoples that existed on this earth long before us. Then mostly through Egypt, Moses to the Jews, the Jews to christianity it has evolved and been used by the people like the Roman Catholic church to manipulate the people and control them. For example the Jesus story is just a rehash of the Egyptian Osiris myth check out this link for the similarities.Parallels between the lives of Jesus and Horus, an Egyptian God
The meaning of both stories is the same it tells the journey of the soul from its birth to death of our animal side so our higher selves can be resurected to become at one with the cosmos again/join the kingdom of heaven.
As for early fears there is the Erik Von Danekan Chariot of the Gods Theory that the old tesatment makes reference to flying chariots and supernatural occurences which in fact were the work of our extra terrestial creators. In genesis in the original hebrew version it says that the Elohim (translated as god in our english versions) created the earth and all the life on it. Elohim is a hebrew word that is plural and means divine ones from the sky (the "from the sky" bit is debated by some). I believe that the there are other summerian texts (the oldest religous documents in history)that people have speculated about in the same way. This would fit in with the vengeful jealous god Yahweh portrayed in the old testament "thou shoult have no other god but me" Also there is the problem with evolution in that we have the missing link the problem being that we evolved in a very short time (a few thousand years) from being a small brained pri-mate walking on all fours to an upright one with a large brain. This should have taken millions of years and there is no other example of this evolutionary leap happening elsewhere and seein as the missing link has never been found extra terrestial intervention can't be ruled out.
So getting back to DLD's original point these possible origins of religion are the starting point you have only to play a game of chinese whispers or watch politicians to see how the truth can be manipulated and misunderstood by the average man.
I have much more to say on this matter but my kids are running round and driving me mad so I will be back later.

It is very interesting how religion is evolving and changing to fit mankind's desires and own understanding...In particular are the cults that are springing off of Christian doctrine (Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormons, Seventh Day ect).

My GF is a Jehova's Witness and is constantly confirming everything anyone can say about the cult in its own. You get the feeling that there is no real sense of salvation and hope, and that the actual church is very suppressive. Basically, if you don't know, JW is a fairly new cult that came up in around the mid 1800's through pastor C.T Russel. JW in a sense have "simplified" the Christian religion and made it more attractive by removing Hell, the Trinity, and the reward of heaven for people. Instead, we will live on earth in paradise forever. I am in no way bashing JW (so if you are please don't get mad). It just bothers me that they use the bible as well to teach...and it is clear as day in the bible and yet they still ignore the truth.

I guess my unclear point is that religion will always evolve into what mankind will want and can only understand...Just like the circumcision, a sacrifice...something physical that was spiritual in itself, now done because of hygiene.

Well, I go around thinking everybody is Reptiles,lizards now after reading David Icke story's.

Pandora said:

Well, I go around thinking everybody is Reptiles,lizards now after reading David Icke story's.

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Yeah I know what you mean me and a friend at work always joke when some politician comes on the tv that they are a reptile. I originally posted up the link to the David Icke site, there is some good stuff on there especially in the research archive although I think that a lot of his own personal beliefs are misguided to say the least.

bigjim7 said:

Yeah I know what you mean me and a friend at work always joke when some politician comes on the tv that they are a reptile. I originally posted up the link to the David Icke site, there is some good stuff on there especially in the research archive although I think that a lot of his own personal beliefs are misguided to say the least.

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The thing is about it tho, Is something really draws me into it, there is something about it. I guess its just really interesting and something different to what we would normally believe aliens to look like.

If it was true would you have sex with a women reptilian lol you could of already had sex with one

But I knew nothing about it until you posted. I read some of his stuff and got the movie, The Brandon Corey Story. Some of the things he points out tho like the reptile,Lizards statues all around London, is this just pure coincidence or what. And like how Eve took the apple from the serpent,reptile pretty Bizarre coincidence.

bigjim7 said:

Also there is the problem with evolution in that we have the missing link the problem being that we evolved in a very short time (a few thousand years) from being a small brained pri-mate walking on all fours to an upright one with a large brain. This should have taken millions of years and there is no other example of this evolutionary leap happening elsewhere and seein as the missing link has never been found extra terrestial intervention can't be ruled out.

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I believe the theory of the "missing link" has been de-bunked. From what I remember reading, homosapiens existed alongside primates and for lack of a better word, cavemen.

I've always wondered if the hygiene thing actually preceded the ritualistic/sacrificial thing. Could the ancients/"primitives" have actually been advanced enough to figure out that there was a hygienic benefit to circumcision?

Bionic said:

I believe the theory of the "missing link" has been de-bunked. From what I remember reading, homosapiens existed alongside primates and for lack of a better word, cavemen.

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You're correct. They now believe that homosapians existed at the same time as the more primitive neanderthals. The neanderthals were stronger than our ancestors, but not as smart. When the ice age hit we adapted to it and they couldn't. As the forests shrunk down (where they hunted large mammals) so did the number of neanderthals, until they went extinct.

I'm a secular humanist but also agnostic to the pros and cons of religion, though it is still my opinion that everyone would be better off if they were secular humanist.

Acharya S' research is impressive: Acharya S - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Vid: Interview with Acharya S on the Christ Conspiracy

There is also a lot of great research at Jesus -is-Lord.com: Jesus Christ is the ONLY Way to God , though from a biased view of a "KJV Christian".

I think the Icke lizard stuff is BS, stemming from a misinterpretation of Kathy O'Brien's tesimony from when she was halucinating on acid that she was given when she was being abused by the sex ring and mind control she was caught up in: The Most Dangerous Game - Google Video . But, since all of the rest of his info is very well documented and research, it does make you think.

I think, if any of the stuff is true from reptilian DNA, then Michael Tsarion is probably the closest to the reality of it when he states that nobody is a shape shifting lizard but some people do have reptilian DNA. Michael Tsarion's Webstream Page...The Origins of Evil, 2012 - The Future of Mankind, Akhenaton and the Cult of Aton, The Destruction of Atlantis, The Subversive Use of Sacred Symbolism in the Media...

All the research from many others about alien DNA is extremely interesting as well.

Hypocrisy in religion is extremely displeasing when not hilarious.

"Jesus Camp" was absolutely terrifying. BUT, I loved how it provided evidence to show hypocrisy of religious leaders in many ways. The most hilarious exposure of the film was Ted Haggard talking about how bad homosexuality is before admitting that during the same time he was seeing a male prostitute and dosing up on meth. lol

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

YouTube - Ted Haggard Bashing Gays - from JESUS CAMP the Movie
YouTube - Ted Haggard Confesses

Pandora said:

The thing is about it tho, Is something really draws me into it, there is something about it. I guess its just really interesting and something different to what we would normally believe aliens to look like.

If it was true would you have sex with a women reptilian lol you could of already had sex with one

But I knew nothing about it until you posted. I read some of his stuff and got the movie, The Brandon Corey Story. Some of the things he points out tho like the reptile,Lizards statues all around London, is this just pure coincidence or what. And like how Eve took the apple from the serpent,reptile pretty Bizarre coincidence.

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It does have a real appeal about it whether thats because it has the ring of truth to it or its something that we want to be true to make our lives more exciting. At first I thought that he had got confused with the reptilian thing because I thought they were symbolic of our lower selves but that led me to the question why do we make the ascociation between the two? maybe it is because of the reptilians that Icke refers to that we get the association.

89:8.2 Men eventually conceived the idea that the offering of some part of the body could take the place of the older and complete human sacrifice. Physical mutilation was also considered to be an acceptable substitute. Hair, nails, blood, and even fingers and toes were sacrificed. The later and well-nigh universal ancient rite of circumcision was an outgrowth of the cult of partial sacrifice; it was purely sacrificial, no thought of hygiene being attached thereto. Men were circumcised; women had their ears pierced.

doublelongdaddy said:

Men were circumcised; women had their ears pierced.

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Damn! Women got off easy on that one. We get a part of our dicks cut off. They get a pinprick on their ears.

You've never heard of female circumcision? ?

Nasty!!!!

Yes it's almost as bad as chopping your dick right off! They probably don't have much fun during sex without a clitoris >

psychotic said:

Yes it's almost as bad as chopping your dick right off! They probably don't have much fun during sex without a clitoris >

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Very true! This was and still remains a practice in certain parts of India. This is another example of a pleasure man has destroyed because of his fear of the beyond. It seems so strange, these sexual practices, but I try to imagine what will be strange about our current sexuality generations from now?


Man has always taken a pleasure, a God given pleasure, twisted it, created a fetish from it, deemed it sinful and deprive himself of the pleasure. Somehow man has always made pleasure a sin and depriving oneself from pleasure as a sacrifice to God. The human race is very STRANGE!

doublelongdaddy said:

Very true! This was and still remains a practice in certain parts of India. This is another example of a pleasure man has destroyed because of his fear of the beyond. It seems so strange, these sexual practices, but I try to imagine what will be strange about our current sexuality generations from now?


Man has always taken a pleasure, a God given pleasure, twisted it, created a fetish from it, deemed it sinful and deprive himself of the pleasure. Somehow man has always made pleasure a sin and depriving oneself from pleasure as a sacrifice to God. The human race is very STRANGE!

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DLD,

You might enjoy reading Herbert Marcuse's EROS AND CIVILIZATION or Sigmund Freud's TOTEM AND TABOO.

jqsderrida said:

DLD,

You might enjoy reading Herbert Marcuse's EROS AND CIVILIZATION or Sigmund Freud's TOTEM AND TABOO.

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I have not read either. Thanks for the tip ALways looking for new books to read....I am such a nerd:s

bigjim7 said:

It does have a real appeal about it whether thats because it has the ring of truth to it or its something that we want to be true to make our lives more exciting. At first I thought that he had got confused with the reptilian thing because I thought they were symbolic of our lower selves but that led me to the question why do we make the ascociation between the two? maybe it is because of the reptilians that Icke refers to that we get the association.

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Their is a strange force, aurora behind this anyway, barriers being broken who knows. It pretty cool when he goes on about the energy and forces and not to fear them.

Good post Bigjim I would love to hear more about what you think on this subject when you have the time. My friend is a Zoroastrian and I find may things about their faith very intriguing.

Asfor the myth of the missing link being debunked its science and palaeontology at that no one "knows" anything. Being certain of things that happened so long ago is laughable. As is DLDs conversation starter which also assumes that we know things pre-history. futhermore that any of those things he mentions in fact can be seen as the birth of religion and/or its practices. However regardless I believe it has proven its efficacy lol. But yeah science by definition is theory so it contradicts itself and goes back and forth and so on so accepting science as fact is foolish in the long run.

I think if man defines God as that unknown force, entity or energy then it could be possible that there are infinitely many. However I like to think of it more like The Force from Star Wars, in which case I assume the role of a
Jedi. Then again sometimes I think we are perfect invention of an alien race which created us in order to end an mutli-dimensional war. Either way something seems to be creating the illusion that we are indeed "moving forward" in time and from that the conclusion has been drawn that the universe must also be going somewhere. So where the hell is that and whens it gonna get there? (from all that we know the universe is growing by the way). So mostly I believe that The Force is real (and we must remember that in the force everything is connected) only changing "the force" to God. But like Jedi we must practice and hone our skills with God which starts with expanding our awareness of it. In doing so I derived that I, we, you, me are God itself, not God in it's entirety - but because everything is connected, it becomes impossible to separate our thread from the vast tapestry that is God so we are God by default. Annnyway over the next few hundred years (less than 500) our race slowly expands its knowledge of that which we do not know and we all learn to be happy, compassionate, loving, accepting, etc. until finally a state of harmony is reached, with which, the universe and all that we can perceive (and more) resonates with ecstasy until maybe the hour glass is turned over again. After the "..God by default..." bit all that is merely what I believe could become of the infinite and ever changing static stream of probabilities if we expand our understand of ourselves. I think perhaps by the nature of tapestries weaving, man as he finds himself, seems alone and separate from "the scheme" which, if he were to untangle the thread, would see are merely extensions of himself.

There is probably alot more i would like to say but I dont even know what i have said already or if i said what I meant, I mean if the words say what I wanted to you understand. its very late and I have spent more time rambling than I had planned to (or have I?) go to Internet Sacred Text Archive Home and enlighten yourself :s :cool: lots to read and learn :D :bounce: enjoi Im reading Thus Spoke Zarathustra (which my pops later told me has nothing to do with Zarathustra :blush:lol ) there. :bouncesqu:

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...drop knowledge so heavy it leaves the world unbalanced...