Unarmed Combat.

[Steve2003]

Hi,

I'm looking into improving my defense skills, I do have some kick boxing experience, however I would like to learn something more similar to the stuff from movie "Hunted", or from some Steven Sagal movies. If you could recommend some books or some websites on such subjects I would appreciate it.

 

[Gardenier90]

Search for Krav Maga on google.

 

[ItsElectric]

I may be starting to get involved in the S.C.A.R.S. program, myself.

-ItsElectric

 

[KeepGrowing]

I would strongly suggest training in Mixed Martial Arts club, over a book any day. It can be hard to learn from a book if you don't have the experience.
Look for a Mixed Martial Arts club that trains fighters. This will allow you to test your stuff in a setting that will most resemble a street fight, I.e. sparring.

If you're looking for weapons training look into the philipino Martial Arts.

If you want book and video suggestions I can post some...

 

[pUNKY]

Can you post some video surgestions please.

 

[SLICEDBEEF]

Check out Tim Larkin's TFT (Target Focus Training) at www.targetfocustraining.com

I'm currently in the TFT mastery program. I've done a couple of SCARS camps with peterson and they where good... at the time.

Tim use to work for Peterson but went out on his own.

My opinion is that the quality of training you get from Tim is above and beyond SCARS... that's my opinion anyways... it's also cheaper! If you want to become a trainer all you have to do is sign up for the mastery program and he'll train you to trainer status...and hold NOTHING back!

I'm really not the type of guy to bash other people and it's not my intent to... but Tim is also a more down to earth kind of guy and alot more open minded (especially if your into MMA and other combat Sports)... I know, because I had to sit with Jerry durring lunch at the level 2 camp and had to listen to his rants!LOL

 

[stillwantmore]

Originally posted by Gardenier90
Search for Krav Maga on google.

Yep, that's some bad ass stuff. I'd like to learn it myself some day soon. The Israeli military trains their soldiers in it. One of my close combat instructors while I was going through training in the Marines knew it and touched on it very briefly with us.

 

[Gardenier90]

Originally posted by stillwantmore
Yep, that's some bad ass stuff. I'd like to learn it myself some day soon. The Israeli military trains their soldiers in it. One of my close combat instructors while I was going through training in the Marines knew it and touched on it very briefly with us.

I'd like to get in some classes myself, but I don't have the time. I may go to one of those huge seminars they have though.

 

[seven_wants_ten]

Move to China and become a Shaolin Monk

 

[wants9]

I, too, interested in studying Krav Maga once I get my weight down. I've also started to look into Pavel Tsatsouline's training programs. He's a former Spetsnaz martial arts instructor who is now an American citizen and, I've read, helped develop the new Marine Corps Martial Arts Program.

 

[penguinsfan]

I took Bando for a couple years, many years ago as a teenager. I think it's a great fighting system, but it may be a little difficult to find an instructor.

 

[ctmwm]

I'm Starting to look around town for a "beginner" IE slightly over weight, not the best coordination type, and that will give me a workout to get in batter shape and give me some hand to hand skills noting outrageous just some basics.

Any advice guys? Falcon? SWM? Anyone Anyone Bueller?

 

[penguinsfan]

Originally posted by ctmwm
Any advice guys?

I think most anything will hone basic skills and help get your in shape. After you feel a little more comfortable, seek out the hardcore stuff, if you so desire.

 

[Super]

The Movie "Hunted" was off the hook!!!!!

 

[derringer57]

Brazillian Jiu-Jitsu. Best for street fights. Dude in UFC used that before there was weight classes and such. Fucked up the biggest guy. Hoice Gracey was his name. The gracey family has their own style too.

 

[TimBo755]

Brazillian Jiu-Jitsu. Best for street fights. Dude in UFC used that before there was weight classes and such. Fucked up the biggest guy. Hoice Gracey was his name. The gracey family has their own style too.

ahh the good ol' days of the 1st UFC's.... rofl

 

[Jason1]

It is the best but his name is Royce Gracie.

 

[9cyclops9]

Brazilian's pronounce their R as an H, or so I'm told.

Krav Maga is great, if you can find the real deal. Most of the stuff you find is watered down, just a step above Tae Bo. If you can find a well-known traditional Kung Fu trainer, that would be good, but stay away from modern Wu Shu because that stuff was developed specifically for show and flashy competitions.

I must say, Brazilian Jiu Jitsu is probably the best single self-defense system out there. But it's always good to cover more than one area, so if you can, do some cross training in another martial art, like traditional Kung Fu, or Muay Thai, etc.

(starting BJJ next week hopefully, when I move back to Boston for college)

 

[Jason1]

You're right R's are pronounced as H's. I have been training jujutsu for a while and I have trained with Royce.

 

[copper_handshak]

http://www.fightingarts.com/forums/ubb/Forum24/HTML/000026.html

http://www.fightingarts.com/

These are two good links.

 

[penguinsfan]

BJJ is good, but it is far less effective when someone has good fundamental ground skills and takedown defense. In the early UFC events, the grapplers kicked ass left and right, but it's the strikers that are big news today in the UFC. Once BJJ and other forms of grappling were studied and countered, those guys started winning much less.

That being said, BJJ is still an awesome art, but I advise anyone to hone their striking skills when focusing on a grappling art.

 

[Zurik]

"I must say, Brazilian Jiu Jitsu is probably the best single self-defense system out there"

You do realize that when Royce Gracie was asked in an interview, why he carries a knife with him he responded that BJJ is better left for the ring. Besides Gracie isn't the best fighter when it comes to technique. He goes for the knees very well but he can't strike for shit. To be frank you can't find a real Krav Maga or Kadochnikov Method instructor, unless you got military connections. I would avoid all those kung-fu, karates and all the other eastern bullshit (except for Thai and kick boxing). If you can't dedicate atleast 3 years don't do martial arts that have throws, choke holds and limb breaking in them, you simply won't learn them well enough to use in real life. Avoid everything that uses fake knifes and doesn't have full-contact sparring. From personal expirience 2-3 years of classical boxing makes a real man out of you(if you don't get your brains knocked out).

 

[sikdogg]

Hi,

I'm looking into improving my defense skills, I do have some kick boxing experience, however I would like to learn something more similar to the stuff from movie "Hunted", or from some Steven Sagal movies. If you could recommend some books or some websites on such subjects I would appreciate it.

The fight scenes you saw on the movie "Hunted" was a filipino art called Sayoc Kali. Steven Segal is trained in a different art called Aikido (in my opinion, very ineffective but looks cool). Segal has kind of created his own version of Aikido which is more focussed on street applications and is much more aggressive compared to traditional aikido.

I have trained in many different martial arts since i was in grade school, my dad thought that it was important to be able to defend yourself and encouraged me to study many arts including: Tae Kwon Do, Boxing, Shotokan, Muay Thai, Kali/JKD, Kenpo Karate, and Brazillian JuJitsu (under Royce Gracie). I've even fought in a couple of amateur kickboxing matches. Let me know if you have any more questions, i'd be glad to help if i can...

 

[penguinsfan]

I think Muay Thai is some pretty bad shit! If I could only choose one discipline to focus on, it'd be Muay Thai and I'd do some additional work on grappling/suBathmateissions to supplement it.

 

[sikdogg]

Muay Thai is defnitely bad-ass... i trained with a guy who was super hard-core and worked us to near death. I agree with you that Muay Thai and grappling is a great combo.

 

[9cyclops9]

"I must say, Brazilian Jiu Jitsu is probably the best single self-defense system out there"

You do realize that when Royce Gracie was asked in an interview, why he carries a knife with him he responded that BJJ is better left for the ring. Besides Gracie isn't the best fighter when it comes to technique. He goes for the knees very well but he can't strike for shit. To be frank you can't find a real Krav Maga or Kadochnikov Method instructor, unless you got military connections. I would avoid all those kung-fu, karates and all the other eastern bullshit (except for Thai and kick boxing). If you can't dedicate atleast 3 years don't do martial arts that have throws, choke holds and limb breaking in them, you simply won't learn them well enough to use in real life. Avoid everything that uses fake knifes and doesn't have full-contact sparring. From personal expirience 2-3 years of classical boxing makes a real man out of you(if you don't get your brains knocked out).

My point was not that BJJ will dominate any street situation. What I meant was that if you were to focus on one single martial art, BJJ is probably the most effective. But my point was that it's good to be well rounded and have several different types of MAs under your belt in order to be most effective in a real life combat situation.

I said I was going to start BJJ next week, but I'm not sure. I'm thinking about doing some of the "eastern bullshit." I'm not really in it for the self defense aspect, that's just an added bonus. Traditional kung fu is a true martial art, where BJJ, Muay Thai, etc is a martial art. There's just something more beautiful and graceful and well...artsy about traditional MAs. I'm not looking to kick anyone's tail on the streets, I probably won't ever have any occasion to need that ability. I'm in it for the fitness, and, well...the art.

 

[sikdogg]

Bro, if you're in it for the workout then you'll like BJJ. If nothing else, it's a great workout. I'm like you right now, i study the martila aret not so much for the martial aspects but more for the art aspect and the workout. Good luck with BJJ and let us know how your first day went...

 

[9cyclops9]

Yeah I mean it may not be BJJ...there's two really great kung fu schools that I'm looking at right now. One is near me (like a block away), run by a guy named Yao Li, who apparently is an international kung fu competition champion, and the other is a bit further, called Yang's Martial Arts Association. Dr. Yang has written tons of books and published a whole lot of videos on traditional kung fu, he trained at the Shaolin Temple and also has a PhD in Chinese Martial Arts. He runs something like 50 schools around the world and does lots of lectures and such...and whaddaya know, his headquarters is right here in Boston, just a subway ride away. I'm going to try out both schools plus a BJJ school right outside of Boston before I make up my mind. We'll see how it goes.

 

[sikdogg]

Are you talking about Dr. Yang Jwing Ming?? He's definitely world known in Kung Fu and Chinese internal medicine. If you're interested in traditional chinese arts, then he's worth looking into.

 

[9cyclops9]

Yeah it's Dr. Yang Jwing Ming. I was so stoked when I found out that he is based just south of me. Hopefully this weekend I'll be able to stop in for a class or two.

 

[penguinsfan]

Any UFC fans here among you martial arts enthusiasts? Gotta be, huh?

Been following it lately? Who/what do you like or dislike?

 

[Jason1]

Renato Verrisimo.

 

[sikdogg]

I'm definitely a UFC fan... i think i've justabout seen all of them (with the exception of one or two) since the first one. I like the old format better where there were no weight categories and the winner was determined after everyone was eliminated that night. They tyipcally fought 3-4 fights that night.

I think and always thought that Randy Coture is the baddest dude in the UFC. He routinely fought guys that were much larger than him and still managed to win the UFC heavyweight title several times and as a light heavyweight, he's pretty much unbeatable unless he get hurt like the last UFC when he got cut on his eye. Everyone was opitimistic that Vitor would give him a fight, but randy dominated him just like he does with everyone that he fights. Randy was also the first guy to beat Vitor years ago when everyone thought that Vitor was unstoppable. Althought Randy is a wrestler, he can also punch as he's proved by knocking out Liddel who is considered an great puncher. At 40 years old, Randy is THE MAN!!

 

[9cyclops9]

<we interrupt your regularly scheduled programming>

Ahem. I went to Yang's place last weekend. It was fantastic. I wanted to try some other schools out also so I went to a Wing Chun school. It sucked horribly. First of all, it's way too far from my apartment. I rode the subway for 30 minutes, then walked for 30 minutes, then I realized I was going to be late so I jogged another 15. I was 10 minutes late, and the instructor wasn't even there yet! Plus, they were getting ready for a tournament, so they only let me participate for about half an hour, and the rest of the time I just watched. Three out of the 5 guys there were tubby and very out of shape, and they were the instructor and 2 black belts! I left an hour before class ended and I won't be back.

Then, yesterday I went to a school owned by a guy named Yao Li. It's the Boston Kung Fu Tai Chi Institute. It was incredible! What a workout! And this place is only a block away from my apartment, so I'm definitely sold! I just have to figure out how to pay for it. :s

 

[sikdogg]

That's great... sounds like you found a winner (and a loser). Good luck i'm sure you'll like the workouts alot.

 

[penguinsfan]

Yeah, Randy Couture is a badass and an inspiration. What he did to Chuck Liddell and Vitor Belfort was inhumane. I have to give props to Tim Sylvia too, despite his recent loss to Frank Mir, another pretty good fighter. As much as you love to hate him for his cockiness, I enjoy watching Phil Baroni to see if he'll unleash the quick fists, but he fought his last fight like a pussy. Cabbage Carrera is fun to watch, as he can take a beating like no one else. Matt Hughes is still tough as hell. I like watching Tito, though his career is falling apart and I don't know if he'll get another UFC fight if he loses to Guy Metzger.

There are a lot of good fighters in the UFC and I can't get enough of that shit. Myself, I like the newer formats. Too many guys were getting hurt under the old system and those guys can't fight their best when they have to fight multiple opponents in one night. I remember when that Steve Jennum guy stepped in and won the third UFC as an alternate and that really soured my opinion on the old system.

 

[sikdogg]

I think that Tito should be able to beat Guy Metzger, but i think that he doesn't have the tools to become the champ again. I think Metzger is from Lion's Den and i just don't believe that their fighter are any good. The best fighter that Lion's Den produced was Frank Shamrock. Ken was always a disappointment... he always hurt this or that.

Yea, it was very annoying/disappointing when Jennum won as an alternate.

 

[Iwant8X6]

I personally train in Pai Lum Tao. The Tawainese police are trained in it.
Its a very well rounded system. Mixing White Lotus Kenpo with Pai Lum Kung Fu.

 

[penguinsfan]

I think that Tito should be able to beat Guy Metzger, but i think that he doesn't have the tools to become the champ again. I think Metzger is from Lion's Den and i just don't believe that their fighter are any good. The best fighter that Lion's Den produced was Frank Shamrock. Ken was always a disappointment... he always hurt this or that.

Yea, it was very annoying/disappointing when Jennum won as an alternate.

You know, when the first few UFCs were planned, they just got a few guys with martial arts backgrounds they thought would be willing to fight, to some extent. Once the sport got exposure, some real talent that had been previously unknown showed interest for the sport. This is evident in any sport. The guys that play pro football and hockey today are a hell of a lot better than the guys of 50 years ago, for the mostpart. If you ask me, any of those guys from the first five or six UFC events (yes, even Gracie) would be lucky to win one fight, if they scheduled five against the top competitors. It's sort of a supply and demand kind of thing. For example, if I plan a suBathmateission event and it doesn't get much exposure, I might actually win something myself. But 10 years later when the sport is popular and young fighters spent years aspiring to fight in it, I wouldn't stand a chance. These guys today are just too good to fight multiple fights in one night, as they'd all be injured in no time.

That's why the Lion's Den was badass years ago. They were one of the only places that schooled people for this style of NHB. Now, it's lost its fame that so many schools train for cage fighting.

 

[sikdogg]

I agree with you for the most part... the problem with the Gracie system is that they don't like to fight with any sort of time limits as this works best to their advantage. When they are constantly broken apart and have to start from standing position, they risk getting hit and losing the fight. Their strategy is generally to wear an opponent down til their opponent make a mistake.

Another point regarding the new format is that since the UFC is now sanctioned with the athletic commision, they were forced to change the format to something similar to boxing. Part of what i enjoyed with the first few UFC's was the rawness of the fighters. It was a true cage match similar to what one would see at underground fight pits.

I also think that part of the Lion's Den's problem is that they became arrogant and only train with each other and don't expose themselves to other schools/systems. They have become somewhat close minded with their training that they've become complacent. An example of this is when Ken trained for his fight with Tito, he claimed that he locked himself in the school and just trained with all his fighters. This may work if your students/trainees are at your level or above as they will push yout to be better, but since that wasn't the case Ken only wasn't able to improve and consequently lost the fight.

 

[loco]

personally I like the concept of JKD. Mix everything you learn along the way. keep what works for you and toss out what doesn't. IMHO if looking for an art for defense no one school of thought is ideal as each has some limits or lack of focus/training in certain areas to it. and the world of true mixed martial arts is evalving all the time. traditional schools are great for discipline and a start but in todays world you better be ready for just about everything.

 

[sikdogg]

Living in Southern California, i've had the opportunity to train under alot of different systems and instructors. I trained in Kali/JKD under Dan Inosanto and realized that although the concept was good, the reality is that JKD as it is today is no differnet from any other system. Yes i agree that the "concept" of JKD is ideal and that all you have to do is just take this and that, put it together and that's what JKD is all about. It's not... It is really a self discovery of yourself and your physical limitations. Bruce Lee's taught Jun Fan as the foundation for JKD, it incorporated Boxing, Savate, wrestling, Wing Chun, and other arts. Although Jun Fan is effective for alot of people it is often mistaken for JKD. Jun Fan was Bruce Lee's JKD... true JKD looks different for each person. This is what Bruce Lee meant when he said "my JKD is not your JKD." Bruce Lee encouraged his students to study as many different arts as possible, but not just take classes for a few months, but to actually study it 'til you get to the advanced levels in the art. Otherwise, how can you honestly know what works for you and what doesn't. Bruce Lee also encourage students to test your skills "under fire" to truely know what works, this meant that one shouldn't be afraid to get into real fights. The "JKD Level" as it used to be called at the Inosanto Academy took decades to achieve... much longer than what most students are willing to put in. The concept of mixed martial arts is a true parallel to the JKD concept.

 

[loco]

for the short time I was in atlanta I got to train a few times with sifu francis fong and some of his instructors, so I can relate. So I couldn't agree with you more sikdogg.

 

[GhosT_DoGG]

That ´Naked Warrior´book looks interesting. It's good you don't need to be a bulging-testestorone-bomb to be a good fighter. Has anybody read it?

 

[Jason1]

Dude its a workout book and it sucks.

 

[9cyclops9]

Let's see...Pavel's work and sucks shouldn't go in the same sentence. He's done some amazing stuff. Now, granted, those exercises won't get you big, but that doesn't mean they suck. That isn't their purpose. They are functional strength exercises. They wouldn't be good to use for a body builder or powerlifter, etc but they are good for say, boxers, martial artists, gymnasts, etc.

 

[Jason1]

The book SUCKS. Do you have it. It is based on two exercises. There is little real information in that book and there is a lot of focuds on pistols which you should never do if you would like to keep your knees. Pavel in general sucks.

 

[9cyclops9]

Ok, you can keep your opinion. That's all it is.

And yes, I own the book. Pavel in general has very good information for CERTAIN types of athletes. That was my point.

 

[Jason1]

Oh ok. I used to like Pavel but to me now it just seems like he is all over the place. And I own a KB and some of his videos on them. My opinion is KB's are useless.

 

[penguinsfan]

The book SUCKS. Do you have it. It is based on two exercises. There is little real information in that book and there is a lot of focuds on pistols which you should never do if you would like to keep your knees. Pavel in general sucks.

What are pistols?