Dumbbell Shoulder Press Vs Military Shoulder Press?

keepingitbig

keepingitbig

Active member
I'm looking for an exercise to build my shoulders up more. I've been doing seated Dumbbell shoulder press, but it doesn't seem to hit my fronts very well. What shoulder parts does the db shoulder press vs the military standing shoulder press help?

My shoulder workout:

Warm-up of shoulders and rear delts.

Seated Dumbbell Shoulder Press.
Upright Row Variations ( ez-bar for close grip and straight bar for wide-grip )
Bent-over barbell delt row.
Plate Raises for isolation.

I was just wondering if the military press will put added mass on my shoulders. Thanks.
 
If you got any rotator cuff issues stay away from the military presses.
Try this variation: Lay on your left side witha typical "shoulder workout weight" dumbell on the floor in front of you as close to your body as possible yet at arms length (elbow as straight as possible). Lift straight-arm until your arm is raised about 45 degrees, then lower slowly until the weight is brushing your ass but don't go all the way to the floor behind you. Without stopping your motion reverse direction until the weight's back to your staring position.

Critical point: You never let the weight go until you've finished your reps; always keep it in the air. Always keep the muscle in use.
Repeat for opposite side.

Give it a try; these not only gave me strength but also shoulder flexibility and helped my rotator cuff rehab work too.

Good luck.
 
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MAXAMEYES;434797 said:
If you got any rotator cuff issues stay away from the military presses.
Try this variation: Lay on your left side witha typical "shoulder workout weight" dumbell on the floor in front of you as close to your body as possible yet at arms length (elbow as straight as possible). Lift straight-arm until your arm is raised about 45 degrees, then lower slowly until the weight is brushing your ass but don't go all the way to the floor behind you. Without stopping your motion reverse direction until the weight's back to your staring position.

Critical point: You never let the weight go until you've finished your reps; always keep it in the air. Always keep the muscle in use.
Repeat for opposite side.

Give it a try; these not only gave me strength but also shoulder flexibility and helped my rotator cuff rehab work too.

Good luck.
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What if I do two sets of DB shoulder press and two sets of military presses? Would that work better?
 
I'd like to say I don't have rc problems either. Just want my shoulders to burst out more. Gives a more aesthetic look to my frame.
 
I would advocate Kettle Bell presses (RKC style). check out dragondoor.com and give these methods a worthy try.
 
I was just wondering if the military press will put added mass on my shoulders.
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Of course it will!!! depends how much weight you use though. If you lift like a bird than no it wont but lift heavy and yes it will. Same as max said if you have RC problems its not the one but it can be minimised done on smith machines and in racks properly.

All the stuff behind the neck or in front of the neck really makes not much difference except you increase chances of RC blow-out behind the neck as it places more stress to those areas.

Best exercises I have found for shoulders

Arnold presses with d/bells {Whole deltoid is worked}
Upright rows (Arguably the best for shoulders) done so that the bar does not come higher then the nipples {All rounder}
Shoulder press on Smith machine or squat rack {All rounder but good for power}
Lateral raises {Side ''Lateral'' head}
Bent over lateral raises or laydown (On bench) lateral raises {Rear deltoid}

You have frontal raises but honestly you dont need them if you incl upright rows or shoulder presses. The front deltoid gets loads of work with bench press and its hardly not worked in a programme at the gym.

Really, you should look into Vince Gironda techniques and see how he advised the lateral raises and the upright rows because that variation really is powerful. How you lift the d/bells on the lateral is how the head is stressed. Make sure the hands are at a 10:2 position on the clock, so the right hand being at 2 and the left being at 10 ... not directly out to the sides as some do them, this hits the traps more and places too much stress on the joint to the elbow and forearms limiting weight.

Dont lift higher than your head either. Just stop at the shoulder height otherwise again you work the traps in the higher range.

For a condensed Shoulder workout I would simply choose the laterals, upright rows and shoulder presses. You got your PUSHING & LIFTING components in for the shoulders and than the laterals are delt with. As well if you like you can try laterals on cable pulley machine which really can take it into another league.
 
Glad y'like it; they worked great for me too. If you wanna total blast then you can use these as a "finisher" with lower weights.
Superset with just about anything else and they'll wring out every last bit of energy from the delts

Red's advise is (as always) outstanding too.

Glad to hear that you got no RC problems...they make life suck. If you do military presses then remember to use extremely strict form; your shoulder can wrench itself unstable in a heartbeat.

That's one good things about those laying lateral raises; the force they put on your shoulder actually helps keep the head of your humerus in place.

keepingitbig;434833 said:
Tried it out today. Man, love this exercise. Really hits the delts really good.
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I had RC problems several years back due to going overboard on shoulder presses. I had used more than I could handle and once at the weak point of that lift, pushing through that to get up the bar I was in pain. I took what must have been 8-10 months for the RC to become stable again. All that time when I placed the right arm behind my back to scratch I had a pain from it.

Didn't go see the doctor or physio but should have really. Instead I just lay-off heavy shoulder work and exercise that stressed the area. I was okay but it was a slow process. Touch wood its all okay now. I have learnt not to treat shoulder press work like dead-lifts and squats because the shoulder joint is so fragile in its socket it doesn't take much for it to go.
 
Thanks red and max. Yeah, I'm afraid of the behind the neck shoulder press. I'll just stick with bent-over delt rows and wide-grip upright rows for the side delts.
 
When I was lifting regularly, I was repping my body weight for reps once a week....215 at the time. I love the barbell press. Lately,.I'm doing hand stand presses untill I can get back into a gym.
 
REDZULU2003;435298 said:
Do it in-front of the neck
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Yeah, I do that, but for the rear I do bent-over delt rows and it has been working out for me for a while now. Heading towards my 4th month. To tell you the truth, I thought I'd never get to the this level. The only downside of lifting is you can't run very fast anymore after you've gained a bit of muscle, but that's blah blah. I do HIIT 2 to 3 times a week, so it's all good.
 
The front of the neck shoulder press doesn't work the rear deltoid, so give it a shot. Its frontal and power. You will find in time that you will go faster, the myth is just that about muscular guys not being faster and if that were the case the sprinters with large legs would be out run in 100m sprint by sparrow legged marathon runners. I tried HIIT and liked it but its brutal, fucking brutal.
 
REDZULU2003;435662 said:
The front of the neck shoulder press doesn't work the rear deltoid, so give it a shot. Its frontal and power. You will find in time that you will go faster, the myth is just that about muscular guys not being faster and if that were the case the sprinters with large legs would be out run in 100m sprint by sparrow legged marathon runners. I tried HIIT and liked it but its brutal, fucking brutal.
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REd. Question, my man. What's your opinion on farmer's walks? Did you see any benefit from them?
 
Lol, long time! Still use the military press today and grown a shit load of mass and strength. I do shoulders twice a week now along with biceps, because they're lacking. Might have to include triceps into that too, because they're suffering in size. Now I do a combination of clean and presses along with military press & DB presses on my 4th shoulder day. I believe in counting no reps when I do a 4th day routine. Just to burn it out.
 
What's the difference? Are they the same? Heard behind the neck gives more mass than standing or seated military press. Your thoughts?
 
More gym talk. Ask yourself ''How is that possible having the lift behind the neck give more mass''. It wont attack the shoulder anymore, if more mass is gained its through the activation of the traps and upper back. I do know that guys risk damaging the shoulder joint lifting heavy behind the neck. Why risk it when in front works great.

Upright rows done with barbell, smith machine or whatever else you wish will work the shoulders damn hard. I found using resistance bands with heavy resistance was incredible at working the shoulders. Indian clubs are good.
 
REDZULU2003;454381 said:
More gym talk. Ask yourself ''How is that possible having the lift behind the neck give more mass''. It wont attack the shoulder anymore, if more mass is gained its through the activation of the traps and upper back. I do know that guys risk damaging the shoulder joint lifting heavy behind the neck. Why risk it when in front works great.

Upright rows done with barbell, smith machine or whatever else you wish will work the shoulders damn hard. I found using resistance bands with heavy resistance was incredible at working the shoulders. Indian clubs are good.
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Thanks for moving my topic. Have you tried behind the neck?
 
keepingitbig;454725 said:
Thanks for moving my topic. Have you tried behind the neck?
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Yes and damaged the rotoator cuffs. Sure it was my own fault for being a dick but seriously mate do it infront not behind. You wont gain anymore muscle or strength with front VS back. Those in the gym that say otherwise NEED to argue the case strongly as to why and how this is the case and I dont see it myself.
 
A properly executed military press is superior to the rest... The only one you really should avoid are neckpresses "the most overrated shit exercise existing that does nothing except destroying your rotator cuff" (P. Trenz)

With all the working out you want to drive you body in the belief that more muscle mass is required for you to live... In order to do that you drive the existing muscle mass to it's limit (muscle failure)... In order to solely trigger the gorwth mechanism you need to use a natural movement... The stress of overextending to get the bar in your neck disturbs... Addionally the work there rather is a feathering of overextendend tissues than muscular work and the deep positions are the important ones in case of shoulder training... This means neckpresses rob the important motion areas from the exercise while milataries have these properly...
 
Thanks for the advice! I actually do both Military to the front and the behind the neck. What I do before doing behind the neck is pyriamid the weight up, then ask for a spot on the heaviest. before I do it though, I foam-roll and do behind the neck shoulder stretches for a pvc pipe at the gym. Really stretches out the muscles and feels better. Overall, my shoulder routine is top-notch.
 
Sounds good. I wouldn't bother doing standing unless your into strongman. Heavy seated presses and incline bench will slap some mass on your shoulders fast.
 
Thanks, Meanwein. I've been doing behind the neck press for a good while. Man, do I love it. Just fits my bodytype I guess. I love how this exercise hits the medial more than the frontal press, giving that wide-broad shoulder look.
 
You'd be wiser to use the upright rows, this mimics the shoulders natural action better then a pressing movement, try it. Width, you cant beat lateral dumbbell lifers and even try the cable crossover. End of the day its not exactly the exercise you use, but the intensity and quality put into it that gets results. Diet and rest obviously just as important but dont be bought into thinking the typical shoulder presses have to be done and need to be done for good shoulders, its bullshit.
 
REDZULU2003;465929 said:
You'd be wiser to use the upright rows, this mimics the shoulders natural action better then a pressing movement, try it. Width, you cant beat lateral dumbbell lifers and even try the cable crossover. End of the day its not exactly the exercise you use, but the intensity and quality put into it that gets results. Diet and rest obviously just as important but dont be bought into thinking the typical shoulder presses have to be done and need to be done for good shoulders, its bullshit.
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I agree, Red. But everyone is different too. Not to worry, I don't use alot of weight when doing behind the neck presses. I go from 90 to about 111 on each workout slowly building the strength and even asking for assistance when going heavier. Just from my experience seeing the best sets of delts coming from btnp. Don Howorth, Kevin Levrone, Shawn Ray, etc etc. These guys have amazing deltoids. I do lateral raises though, that's my favorite exercise. But I always start with behind the neck with light weight to progressively going heavier with lower reps. I do about 4 to 6 sets of 6 to 8. After that seated DB military to isolate the all the deltoids, shrugs, side laterals, than the real delt machine and I'm off.
 
keepingitbig;434791 said:
I'm looking for an exercise to build my shoulders up more. I've been doing seated Dumbbell shoulder press, but it doesn't seem to hit my fronts very well. What shoulder parts does the db shoulder press vs the military standing shoulder press help?

My shoulder workout:

Warm-up of shoulders and rear delts.

Seated Dumbbell Shoulder Press.
Upright Row Variations ( ez-bar for close grip and straight bar for wide-grip )
Bent-over barbell delt row.
Plate Raises for isolation.

I was just wondering if the military press will put added mass on my shoulders. Thanks.
Click to expand...

Do dumbell press and over head press (military press) with heavier weigh, max of six-8 reps. Then superset it with lateral isolation raises to hit all 3 shoulder muscles. alternate the DB press with the OHP after each super set. Total of 3 sets.
 
My advice is to not do the dumbbell and barbell press during the same workout, but switch off. Also, if you specifically do rotator cuff exercises (internal rotation, external roation, etc), this will increase your overhead and bench pressing capabilities. Even though it's not a 100% shoulder exercise, my width/thickness has increased partly to heavy barbell and dumbbell chest work.
 
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