Yes, I agree that it is pretty dangerous for people to base all their beliefs on something they can not be sure of (the reincarnations), but I believe this way of thinking (even if wrong) makes us all better people- it makes us treat animals as equal (which I find really good, as I believe they are JUST like us- have feelings and are logical, it is just that they are not as "inteligent" as we are). So you are right, but I chose to believe in this, because it makes me a better person (now in the center of EVERYTHING we discuss is the DEFINITION of the words we say. "Better" might mean something to you and something completely different for me. But it makes me better- making me feel like a good person- a joyful feeling). This is why I choose to believe in that. Now I can not say I am right- since I have NO proof of anything, this is just the reasoning behind my beliefs.
I see your point and I absolutely agree- it is not only humans that eat living beings- we can be eaten as well, this is why we can't say that people are the "bad guys" in this movie. But think about it that way- is not it because of our superior intellect that we should end this cycle of killing. Humans are the leading force (and have been the leading force ever since we started using our brains to the level where we started inventing things), we are not directly threatened by anything (we are threatened, but I would not say directly (as the definition of directly is to be constanly afraid of being attacked throughout the whole day/night)), we are living "peacefully" in our own society not being threatened like we were before (back when we lived in caves). We have no reason to kill animals to just survive an attack (really depends on where you are of course, but I am talking about the majority of us- the ones that are not living in the Ammazon, Africa or wherever). The only reason we have to kill is just to feed ourselves (unlike before where we have been attacked and had to fight to save our lives) (and for economic reasons, but let's just keep ourselves away from that aspect as we are discussing the value of life when compared to our natural needs and personally I do not consider having leather clothes a NATURAL need). We can feed from plants as well. Yes, I know- you are going to say that we would then be unable to provide vital nutrients to our diet and therefore have our health put at risk. But whatever we can not get from feeding from plants- can't we get it as supplementation? It is now that we have mineral, vitamin, protein etc. supplementation where we can provide what we lack. Take a look at this industry it is growing vastly.
I included the predator attacking someone close to you example to just show you that whenever a human gets killed by a bear- it is not the bear that should be considered the "bad guy", because we, people, do that to bears (all animals in general, but seems we are talking about bears now) all the time.
I will have to 100% disagree with what you said about the world. "our world is great. sure everything cant be perfect but we will be long gone before we can do to this planet what has happened MANY times before we were ever here. but i am living a great life. greed spawns greatness. now that does not mean everyone should be greedy and harmful to others." Take a good look at the world you are living in. You have people being killed, threatened, mother nature being slowly but surely destroyed, you have a world where the system we live in ecourages us to harvest greed. The one quality that can turn us against each other instead of all people moving forward to a better furute. I simply can not understand how can someone praise that quality of ours that only leads to our stagnation as species.
To what you say about nutrition- I already gave you an answer above, but please- answer me this- Would you like to have someone close to you killed by a bear (cause bears are what we mostly using as an example it seems rofl!) to just provide nutriets the bear would feel healthier with? The bear needs to eat human meat to provide certain nutrients (I am not saying that it is true- I am just using this as an illustration) so it can feel healthier (just like you say we should eat animals to just provide nutrients we need to feel healthier (even though I gave you an alternative to this above)), so then having a bear eating someone close to you would not be considered wrong, right? You would have no reason to be angry- the bear is just doing it so it can feel "healther". Sure, it can survive without killing the ones close to you, but you know, it's gonna feel "healthier".
"only a fool would choose to save an animal life over a human life." Please explain WHY? I want to hear 100% reasoning.
Now about what you said about plants- the difference between plants and animals is that plants are more of "individual". They do not suffer when you "kill" one of them. They are emotionless (and I just read a study online to make sure I am writing BS (though I might actually write complete BS since I do not believe I am "right", I always know that I could be wrong. Thinking that you are 100% right is foolish as it makes you narrow minded and stop you to see things outside of your beliefs (that can be actually more "truthful" than yours)). When you kill it- it does not feel any pain (just like us and animals (though, we are considered animals as well)). There is no relative that would feel "bad" about having someone close to "it" being killed.
"a person cant be karma free unless they eat their own shit constantly."- yea but 1st you have to eat something to produce shit. So if what you are 1st was a an animal- you would still not be "karma-free", cause you already ate an animal OR cause you keep on eating that animal over and over again (rofl! I had to laugh that off!
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"but just support high quality production of that food source. not factory farming of animals or plants."- I absolutely have to agree!
"and i know that even though i say something may not be a belief to me and i see it as fact, another person may see it as a belief for me and not fact. "- yes I find this truthful as well.
"enjoying the conversation zam. it's nice to talk with people who don't get all sensitive or bent out of shape when someone has a different point of view. you rock "- Wow, thanks very much! Right back at you mate!
P.S- Damn it took me nearly an hour to just think of how to answer what you wrote above! I am unsure whether my reasoning and logic are good, but this is the way I see things. If they are not good- well then I should consider myself "dumb", shouldn't I? AHHAHAHAHAH!
