Fox News lobbying arm for right wing....

Oh yeah, that was great. I remember that one. Doesn't that dude look like an android?

And it's off-topic, but Burt Renolds looks fuckin' Asian these days. I've seen him in a Maaco commercial recently. Looks like an Eskimo. I guess it's from all that bad plastic surgery.

1. Someone mentioned "Neo-conservatives" IMO, they are the most dangerous of all political stripes. Even principled Republicans recognize that. Republican Congressman Ron Paul of Texas gave a great speech/article called "Neo-conservatives."

2. Bernie Goldberg- I havent read his books. He has a new one out btw. But i do imagine what he has to say is truthful. Not familiar with his politics, but I like him on Real Sports with Bryant Gumbel.

As far as political books, my favorites are probably by Larry Elder, Ten Things you Cant Say in America" particularly. From the mention of Larry, I could naturally follow into what I believe is one of the worst aspects of modern "liberalism" and that is the creation of false racism as a cottage industry for Democrats; and that could naturally expose why I believe democrats intentionally sabotage the educational system. But that is such a different topic.

Originally posted by NeXus
My theory is that people who vote Republican are not as smart as your typical NYC left-wing liberal.

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Actually, in a survey conducted by Berkeley of highest education obtained:

7.3% of"strong" Republicans have a graduate degree versus 5.6% of "strong" Democrats.
19.1% of Repubs have a Bachelor degree versus 8.9% of Demos.
5.2% of Repubs have Jr College versus 3.6% for Demos.
48.5% of Repubs have High School versus 44.4% for Demos.
20% of Repubs have dropped out of HS versus 37.4% of Demos.

Republicans are more educated at all levels than are Democrats.

Especially in the field of Satanism.

bobbdobbs
Who know how that study was conducted or anything so I dont really buy your statistics, who knows where you got it.

I saw Bernie Goldberg,whos a typical right-winger, was on The Daily Show w/ Jon Stewart and Bernie and Jon both agreed that there was one conservative cable news channel, of course FoxNews. I swear to God, watch November 18th show, which was Tuesday. I saw the re-run on Wed.
It was a good show. Jon was kinda makin fun of that fact Bernie thinks theres a liberal media by using some stupid bubble analogy. I think Bill Mahar and Jon Stewart should get their own commentary show together like Bill O'Reilly's show.

bigbutnottoo,
Your making some bold statements about Dems sabotaging the educational systems. You gotta say something to back it up. Maybe you have haven't heard of something called No Child Left Behind? What an ironic name for something that actually leaves many children behind, by giving federal funding to schools that lower their dropout rate by putting failing students into some lame-ass categories like "transferred" or "enrolled in GED". And with the whole $87 billion and the tax-breaks to everyone, Bush is running short of money for schools. So dont tell me Democrats are to be blamed for schools.

Oh yeah and what does "creation of false racism as a cottage industry for Democrats" supposed to mean?

claims of intelligence and conspiracy aside . . .

it may be useful to remind that the left has no real structured power base like the right does. the right wing has a unified front of industry, the religious right, and yes some big media ownership.

there are left leaning publications, organizations, ect. but a simple look at the organizational structure will reveal that the base of leftist politics is disjointed at best. conservatives have excelled at organizing and enforcing their agendas. i will also say that the more empirical studies i read, the more i think conservative economics and social agendas (basically one in the same) is perhaps well-intentioned on some level, but in the end wholly ineffective. i try to not judge conservatives, and i know many, but after a certain point i identify hard-lining conservatives as people that have bought into some serious disinformation.

this stuff about smarter or dumber . . . who cares really.

i still equate it to the fact that i feel conservative thought lines tend to stem from self-interest, and a desire to enforce certain conservative principles.

liberals subscribe to a more idealistic philosophy, encouraging globalization, change and class equality. none of us have a doctorate, that i know of anyway, so sighting various stats and such are really only tit-for-tat fodder. your political identity is related to your basic belief about what the correct role of government is and how it should be exercised.

i really hate party politics, i think the current climate is as stagnant as it's ever been. i'm not terribly impressed with any of the demo candidates, but i see several of them as being a preferable option to bush's policies. i don't think bush has really been a terrible president even though i don't agree with what he stands for, but the room for improvement is substantial at this point.

Originally posted by NeXus
I dont really buy your statistics

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Feel free to post your own in support of your "theory."

hi bobbdobbs, would you mind linking that survey you posted? i want to bookmark it, could be a useful citation for a stats reserach paper i have to write in the near future. thanks, i appreciate it.

Dont worry the study probably dosent exist, or taken out of context, or conducted with a bias or whatever.

"conservatives have excelled at organizing and enforcing their agendas"-goodbutnotgreat

Gee, you know who was also great at organizing, and forcing their agendas upon people through patriotism and endless campaigning and propaganda??

The Nazi's! Yes you all remember the Third Reich and Hitler, who got everyone to to blame Jews and band together in a masterplan that ended up with Hitler trying to take over the world. Remember things usually are done for power and money. You guys need to be more skeptical and cynical.

But your right, the Left needs to be more mainstream and organize better. I agree 100%. They could also use a multi-billionaire owner who will give them their own world-wide magazines, commentators, talk radio shows, and of course, their own news channel. Someone like Rupert Murdoch who actually does this for the Right. Then maybe the Left can compete.

Think about, there is literally liquid gold over in the Middle East and September 11 was the best thing that has happened to Bush politically. It him gave a blank check for an endless War on Terrorism. Well guess who gets the multi-billion dollar construction job in Iraq. Of course its Haliburton. And guess who is former CEO top shareholder of Haliburton. Of course Vice Pres Dick Cheney. Rich, white men run this country that is based on a democracy fo the people.

bigbutnottoo,
you still gotta back up what you said. Im waiting for some evidence.

Originally posted by goodbutnotgreat
hi bobbdobbs, would you mind linking that survey you posted? i want to bookmark it, could be a useful citation for a stats reserach paper i have to write in the near future. thanks, i appreciate it.

Click to expand...

http://transformer.cs.caltech.edu/archives/000029.html

I ran the numbers into a spread sheet to get the relative percentage of affiliates in each education level -- since the table didn't itself total up to 100% in each row.

Originally posted by NeXus
Dont worry the study probably dosent exist

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I do believe you just called me a liar. Cool off, bud. Wipe the spittle from your lips and count to ten. Think peaceful thoughts. Happy thoughts. The rage will pass.

Originally posted by bobbdobbs
Actually, in a survey conducted by Berkeley of highest education obtained:

7.3% of"strong" Republicans have a graduate degree versus 5.6% of "strong" Democrats.
19.1% of Repubs have a Bachelor degree versus 8.9% of Demos.
5.2% of Repubs have Jr College versus 3.6% for Demos.
48.5% of Repubs have High School versus 44.4% for Demos.
20% of Repubs have dropped out of HS versus 37.4% of Demos.

Republicans are more educated at all levels than are Democrats.

Click to expand...

Anyone who has taken a statistics class can see through this. When you mix in the uneducated, poor(who are predominately democrats), it is going to bring down the statistics across the board for the democrats. If you did not mix them in, you will see that more democrats are 'more educated on all levels'(to correct your incorrect english)' than republicans.

This coming from an independent. I personally hate our government.

Originally posted by Spektrum
If you did not mix them in, you will see that more democrats are 'more educated on all levels ... than republicans.

Click to expand...

It will be interesting to see how you weight your data. But have at it. You've stated your conclusion. Now produce the numbers.

In the samples, there were 1.7 times more "strong democrats" than "strong republicans." But there were less than 1.7 times more graduate degree holding democrats.

I don't know what statistical handwaving you intend, but in the rest of the world, that means that if you pick an individual republican, his chances of having a graduate degree are higher than if you pick an individual democrat.

Originally posted by Spektrum
If you did not mix them in, you will see that more democrats are 'more educated on all levels... than republicans.

Click to expand...

Just to be sporting, I removed, below, all the highschool dropouts from both the strong repubs and strong dems. Here are the new figures:

9.1% repubs versus 8.9% dems have graduate degrees.
23.9% repubs versus 14.3% dems have bachelor degrees.
6.5% repubs versus 5.8% dems have jr college degrees.
60.6% repubs versus 71.0% dems have high school diplomas.

Doesn't seem to help your case. Looks like republicans remain more highly educated than democrats.

Although I don't see the logic in throwing out less educated groups in order to bring up the education average -- seems kinda cheaty.

It just seems odd to me... I mean, how do they collect this data?

Just wanted to add in... to quote the moron himself, "fuzzy math".

Originally posted by NeXus
bobbdobbs
bigbutnottoo,
Your making some bold statements about Dems sabotaging the educational systems. You gotta say something to back it up. Maybe you have haven't heard of something called No Child Left Behind? What an ironic name for something that actually leaves many children behind, by giving federal funding to schools that lower their dropout rate by putting failing students into some lame-ass categories like "transferred" or "enrolled in GED". And with the whole $87 billion and the tax-breaks to everyone, Bush is running short of money for schools. So dont tell me Democrats are to be blamed for schools.

Oh yeah and what does "creation of false racism as a cottage industry for Democrats" supposed to mean?

Click to expand...

As I said, I'm not a Republican, but then again neither is Bush. Republicans are supossed to end the Department of Education, not increase the funding higher than Clinton levels.
Ifyou even think education has anything to do with the president, please go back and read the Constitution.

Yes, when it comes to politics, you do favors for the people who get you elected. For Democrats, one main supporter is teacher unions. Another is self-appointed "black leaders." If education improves in any way, Democrats stand to lose. If public schools somehow improved, Democrats would no longer be able to whine about needing more money to improve education. If parents were allowed to send their children to better schools, it might put teachers out of jobs and/or lower union pay (since private school teachers who are much better get paid less,among other things). Thats why democrats oppose vouchers, even though most black parents support them. Just like if the general lives of black people improve, they are less likely to support democrats. So it is in the interest of democrats to keep black people poor and angry and poor people poor. That is how they buy their votes by promising to help certain groups out, playing class warfare and the racecard. Dems create an industry out of racism and victimhood, instead of showing the people they profess to help the real way to wealth and happiness, which is of course: rational self-interest.

So, yes racism and poverty are industries for democrats. You could argue that oil or whatever is an industry for Republicans. But overall Republicans believe that adults are rational beings that are best left to make their own decisions and parents should make decisions for their children, not political unions with levelsof beauracracy.Democrats philosophically believe that people are helpless pitiful little creatures that need the government to run their lives. And yes, modern day Democrats are the modern day Slave Masters.

Since we had to get on the whole racial political thing:

Did you also know that Gun Control was invented solely for the purpose of disarming blacks so they would be obedient and subserviant to those limousine liberals?And that the first federal gun law was an almost exact translated copy of Hitler's law disarming Jews?

If we really want to get into why Democrats are bad for blacks, whites, Americans, I can go on and on.

Originally posted by Spektrum
how do they collect this data?

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That's a legit question. You can follow the link to the database origin and find out.

My point in posting the results was merely because the original poster said liberals were smarter than republicans. But he didn't offer any supporting evidence.

So I did a google search on the web and found those statistics. They indicated a reverse correlation.

If the original poster now wants to produce evidence in support of his assertion, that would be cool.

But as of this moment, the only person posting any evidence one way or the other is me.

Of course it is open to scrutiny -- but at least it is something.

For someone to think that there isnt a class warfare is livin under a rock. When people spend millions on just their mansion and some will never ever even make close to that in their entire lifetime, you cant tell me thats not a substancial difference of the classes.

All I think is that rich people should pay the same amount of taxes, percentage wise, as a poor person. And say fuck this off-shore banking, which cheats the gov. out of taxs and fuck these trade agreements which send our jobs overseas.

Also liberals are different that democrats. In reality Dems and Repubs are two heads of the same beast. Yes Dems are better just like Sadaam Hussein is better than Adolf Hitler, both bad, but one is better than the other.

bigbutnottoo seems to think that their is some left-wing democratic conspiracy to take over the world and to keep blacks repressed and kids stupid. Thats so off base theres not even a response for it besides your wrong. Oh, and your telling me that you would rather the Repubs do favors for heartless big oil and energy corporations than the Dems do favors for Teachers Unions? Your crazy. Oh and you fail to support your Slave Master George Bush of the No Child Left Behind Act. All you say is some rederick of a secret agenda which sounds like something from O'Reilly.

bobbdobbs
Maybe its just me but when I read the stats, I got this...

if you add up the Bachelors degree's percentages you get this,

50% of people who have Bachelors are Dems
38.4% of people who have Bach. are Repubs

and im not including Ind. and other party. Oh and for the record, when I said the thing about being smarter than Rebubs, I was referring to liberals being smarter not necessarily Dems. But your study proved my right anyways so, what the hell.

And Im not a Dem, I'm Independant.

so take the stats and bury them because they dont support your agrument, also I was wondering what State all you are from? Is it the Bible Belt? Deep South? Mississippi? just kidding but seriously where do y'all live? Maybe I'll do a study of my own...

NeXuS: There are not too many of us outspoken liberals out there. Mainly because we're tired of debating with people who feel like they are forced to pick a side. These people are usually pigheaded and even with blatant facts, will not even give your ideas a chance. Btw, our government does suck and anyone who fails to realize it is hopeless in my eyes. Our government no longer works for the people. Well, it does, but only a small percentage of us. Read the "Communist Manifesto", these principles apply to all countries, and our country is no different.

As far as class warfare, it's out there but you usually cannot see it. As someone who has been pennyless, I have seen my fair share of it. I remember fellow fast food workers purposely dropping change out the drive through window when handing it to someone in a new mercedes or similar. I've also seen terrible things done to food of snooty old ladies covered in jewelry. I've also seen hoopties drive really, REALLY slow in front of 50k-60k cars on purpose. The greatest thing I've seen recently was a couple of kids from the local ghetto when to a neighborhood with 500k+ houses and put dog shit in each persons mailbox.

While its non-violent, it's still class warfare. It will get worse as time goes on. If you don't believe me, read a history book. Look at how many revolutions occured in the late 1800's due to social oppression. Read some of the writings of Karl Marwho co-wrote the Communist Manifesto), he also addresses it.

And in my opinion, anything over 90k/year is "rich". I don't care what the government classifies rich as.